------------------- 2026-06-08 to 2026-06-14 ## Index - [[#seylance2897|seylance2897]] - [[#lancehedrick|lancehedrick]] - [[#opp4004|opp4004]] - [[#GPT-5.5 Thinking Summary|GPT-5.5 Thinking Summary]] ## seylance2897 ### 2026-06-08 - 12:38 AM `#origins-and-producers`: we'll have an allocation of an ALO washed lot. It was the best coffee i tasted in Ethiopia while i was there.... I think there will be a few other lots that will give it run for its money.. but it was wtf good - 12:38 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Thanks! - 3:47 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah exactly - 3:47 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Gerald Kamberare is making a honey experimental lot for us đŸ«Ł Attachments: - [WhatsApp_Image_2026-06-08_at_09.11.12.jpeg](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078447734456415/1513540058731516104/WhatsApp_Image_2026-06-08_at_09.11.12.jpeg?ex=6a369a06&is=6a354886&hm=a22256a766d15993c857d9a2649d5f579de7f6b81fa682992d113e16db200748&) (image/jpeg 1200x1600) - 3:48 PM `#origins-and-producers`: [attachment only] Attachments: - [WhatsApp_Image_2026-06-08_at_09.11.14_1.jpeg](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078447734456415/1513540182626930878/WhatsApp_Image_2026-06-08_at_09.11.14_1.jpeg?ex=6a369a23&is=6a3548a3&hm=36238701cd3afa819cac3be38bac378cff634df9b6f35654fe39b4fe6c92da2a&) (image/jpeg 1200x1600) - 5:29 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hahah Peter always tries to make a better lot than Gerald each year. They're very good friends. Gerald is just a much much smaller scale - 5:30 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Also, this is just the mid-harvest. Its very, very small.. so its eaiser to do fun tests with it - 6:07 PM `#current-menu`: hahah ayoooooooo - 6:07 PM `#current-menu`: did you taste geralds coffee yet? - 6:09 PM `#current-menu`: lemme know.. still curious how everyone finds the fruit on that coffee - 6:10 PM `#current-menu`: I'll send this photo to him - 6:11 PM `#current-menu`: haha i will - 6:15 PM `#current-menu`: haha there is avery very small chance this is good enough to buy/roast... but maybe - 6:16 PM `#current-menu`: oh man, that would be amazing - 6:16 PM `#current-menu`: we'll find out in about 20 days once it dries - 6:17 PM `#current-menu`: after this i'll let <@908458585728630836> go back to hype hero - 8:23 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Duber is in subs but only for those who have 5 coffees or more - 8:24 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: its very, very good. I'm cupping it against La Casita this afternoon... we'll see how it goes. La casita will be straight out the roaster though - 8:26 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: same - 8:53 PM `#current-menu`: hah yeah its a prety diffficult coffee to talk about - 8:53 PM `#current-menu`: for me it has this strange way of bouncing around the fruit goes like straight jammy fruit to fresh fruit to bright af fruit... its a pretty facinating coffee - 9:09 PM `#current-menu`: i use to buy coffees from el Socorro about 5 years ago... - 9:10 PM `#current-menu`: keep me posted on how it rests for you, fruit wise. I'm cupping it every day.. but I'm curious how it changes for other people to. I need really good info for going into next season what we should change in the process - 9:10 PM `#current-menu`: This goes to everyone cupping the coffee as it rests - 9:11 PM `#current-menu`: all in all i think it was a hella fascinating little lot of coffee - 9:12 PM `#current-menu`: this one is not straight forward haha - 9:12 PM `#current-menu`: its giving some of the best cuppers in the world a run around - 9:13 PM `#current-menu`: [attachment only] Attachments: - [IMG_5984.HEIC](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1486021596815822848/1513621986126069941/IMG_5984.HEIC?ex=6a363d93&is=6a34ec13&hm=aa1b074af5661e35bf8c162c70a8d00109be9f1d4f5de52fd6762ab254fa12dc&) (image/heic) - 9:13 PM `#current-menu`: that didn't work - 9:14 PM `#current-menu`: David Berrio's coffee is cupping like proper clean passion fruit... also Dwights red gesha is floral af.. .like proper gesha profile - 9:16 PM `#current-menu`: david berios coffee is a bigger coffee than duber, like huge passion fruit, very bright acid kick to the head haha... dubers coffee was a little more nuanced and 'pretty' tropical ha - 9:16 PM `#current-menu`: from arcane estate - 9:17 PM `#current-menu`: this cup, at least is very clean... no hot fruit - 9:18 PM `#current-menu`: but his coffee tends to wiggle around the fermentation levels haha - 9:19 PM `#current-menu`: ha i'd say not that layerd not like dubers coffee is. Its more singularly passion fruit - 9:26 PM `#current-menu`: ha what kind of spoilers? - 9:27 PM `#origins-and-producers`: haha all good - 9:29 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Guatemala has had a really tough time... Climate change, soil degradation, old varieties, unintended crosses with catimores, etc., with soil remediation and better varieties/ more diversity i think Guatemala could produce exceptional coffees... - 9:30 PM `#origins-and-producers`: All that to be said, some coffees from Guatemala can be amazing. They just aren't the profiles I'm paricularly looking for right now - 9:30 PM `#current-menu`: oh subs? - 9:30 PM `#current-menu`: has no one gotten it yet? - 9:31 PM `#current-menu`: [attachment only] Attachments: - [Screenshot_2026-06-08_at_3.31.05_PM.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1486021596815822848/1513626608840478971/Screenshot_2026-06-08_at_3.31.05_PM.png?ex=6a3641e1&is=6a34f061&hm=69f9695563cb46216a30c2cf55bb3498546078c710c70eb9e4c3ce130800f2cf&) (image/png 1764x46) - 9:52 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Raul Perez from Soledad is also an incredible producer... its just so so so hard to keep those coffees from leaning nutty ( climate getting too warm, i believe)... then you go to the high high elevations in huehue and its so so so hard to keep those coffees from leaning vegetal (this is caitmore crosses, i believe) - 9:53 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i've been working with a number of people in guatemala for the last few years trying to find something to buy... its just really really tough - 9:56 PM `#origins-and-producers`: you can get some properly dense and pretty amazing like 86ish point coffees in huehue... super solid, good sweetness, good acid... but, just can't get the fruit complexity to get into the 87s/88s... but they can be super beautiful 86s - 9:58 PM `#origins-and-producers`: there is some SL in guat.. the problem is is that none of us know what SL28 is anymore 😂 - 9:59 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i've had converastion about trying to get pink, chiroso, sidra, etc.. into guatemala.. its just time consuming... i think in 10 years we definitely will see more varieties in guatemala - 9:59 PM `#origins-and-producers`: the problem is they have a lot of Gesha and it was just the wrong variety for Guatemala IMO - 10:03 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah exactly.. its just not cold enough to develop the florality and complexity - 10:05 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah exactly in theory... if we are trying to grow the highest quality cherry, select the highest quality cherry, why not try to get as much out of that coffee as literally possible.. extract to 26ish+ % - 10:12 PM `#origins-and-producers`: for sure.. i'm here for the experimentation and trend shifts.. i think we learn each time... right now i'm probably extracting closer to 14% hahaha... BUT, I'm fully not done with the get as much out of the coffee as possible theory.. i'm just doing it on my sample roaster instead haha... - 10:13 PM `#origins-and-producers`: right now I feel like we lose too much in the roaster by roasting for peak solubility - 10:13 PM `#origins-and-producers`: for sure, Japan also develops coffees significantly more than most US roasters... so the more you push coffee in the roaster the better its going ot taste at lower EYs - 10:13 PM `#origins-and-producers`: also true - 10:18 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hella coarser - 10:18 PM `#origins-and-producers`: but <@839279408057024512> is wayyyyy more qualified to talk brewing/extraction than me haha - 10:18 PM `#origins-and-producers`: you were here this morning??? - 10:19 PM `#origins-and-producers`: in the cafe we're targeting around 24ish% in the aeropress.. thats because its an aeropress.. .we'll be switching to pour-overs soon with a lower EY very soon - 10:30 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hahaha i was just going to comment that this channel always gets so far out of the lane - 10:35 PM `#origins-and-producers`: okay back to cupping... - 10:54 PM `#origins-and-producers`: how long you here for? - 10:55 PM `#origins-and-producers`: could probably cup together if you want on like thursday or friday moring - 11:23 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ah word, defintely let me know next time you come through. and congratulations! - 11:24 PM `#origins-and-producers`: this is pretty hard as it kind of needs to be broken down into beginner intermediate and advanced... its just challening to conceptualize - 11:32 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: its very good. Bonye Robe is also a really cool separation from that site this year ### 2026-06-09 - 12:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ready? - 12:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: [attachment only] Attachments: - [Screenshot_2026-06-08_at_6.01.50_PM.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1513664406343520416/Screenshot_2026-06-08_at_6.01.50_PM.png?ex=6a366514&is=6a351394&hm=f03e75ee1fc53f7b2cbfe66b36d6e1ee33a8be7047c49ee79bcfbf8e136c4489&) (image/png 424x692) - 12:02 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: [attachment only] Attachments: - [Screenshot_2026-06-08_at_6.02.11_PM.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1513664501994754198/Screenshot_2026-06-08_at_6.02.11_PM.png?ex=6a36652b&is=6a3513ab&hm=9dae97f688f349b1e6c7b336f302d8d2790301ae3ecf5d23a142b5dc9782ae9d&) (image/png 416x998) - 12:02 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: gotta catch em all - 12:02 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: its is probably 90% of what we'll reelase.. still waiting on some samples - 12:45 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: These are still with Emily! - 1:04 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: is it washed? - 1:49 PM `#origins-and-producers`: is el diamante infused?? Definitely not - 1:50 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: someday I'd love to taste catimores together - 3:06 PM `#origins-and-producers`: The only investment is the project around trying to pay higher prices for higher quality in Urrao specifically. This has proven to be like very effective in Huila and Kenya where we also have started such projects... also now in Peru. But we can really see that as producers get paid more then quality generally goes up. normal coffee buying is how do we get better coffee for cheaper... we've approached it completely the opposite. Trying to figure out how to get better coffee by paying higher prices and essentially competing against ourselves. if that makes sense - 3:12 PM `#origins-and-producers`: the best SL9s right now are around 15-17$/lb green - for comparison the best chirosos are around 8$ green - 3:12 PM `#origins-and-producers`: there is also soooooo much SL9 in peru that hasn't been brought to market yet.. so it'll be interesting to see what happen s - 3:13 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I'm sure hyped producers will continue to gain higher and higher demand and those coffees will go up.. hopefully pully other coffees/producers in the region up with them - 3:15 PM `#origins-and-producers`: there is also way way way way more coffee in Peru than in Panama.. i'm guessing there will be some producers in peru that might be able to start selling their coffees closer to 75-100$/lb but its all market driven... there has to be a market that will pay it đŸ€·â€â™€ïž - 3:16 PM `#origins-and-producers`: also i've tasted 94+ coffees in panama i've nver tasted that in Peru... peru might have the potential to get to those scores.. but if they do it hasn't been actualized yet - 3:17 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I personally believe that coffees over 90... into the 92is point range should be $50+/lb and higher as cup score goes up. those coffees are mircles and price/ cup still isn't that high - 3:23 PM `#origins-and-producers`: thats what this is for! ask all the questions! i try to get on as much as I can to answer them... but there are also alot of very smart people on this discord! - 3:23 PM `#origins-and-producers`: There are a couple japanese roasteres with Sl9 do you know coffee county? - 3:27 PM `#origins-and-producers`: haha woof.... SL9 is still something of a mystery of a variety - 3:29 PM `#origins-and-producers`: This sample comes from a very rare cultivar. I had not previously encountered this specific profile in my database. It belongs to the "Ethiopian Legacy" group. Well-known cultivars in this genetic group include SL-34, K-7, and Mibirizi, as well as SL-09. In fact, it is very close to SL-09—and could well be that variety—given that we must allow for slight genetic variations stemming from older, not always precisely identified references. Today, among all the SL varieties selected in the 1930s, SL-28 and SL-34 are the most widely cultivated in East Africa. SL-09 is not widely grown; it is said to be highly susceptible to Coffee Berry Disease (note: this is distinct from the coffee berry borer pest), a disease endemic to East Africa but absent from the Americas. - 3:29 PM `#origins-and-producers`: This is what we have from Christophe who did the genetic fingerprinting for SL9 - 3:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: There is also a very lengthly blog post written by <@421132246536159232> about SL9 if your looking for a nice read - 3:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: He has a way with words - 3:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Seriously - 3:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ? - 3:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: when you write that? - 3:33 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Thanks! - 3:35 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hahahaha - 3:35 PM `#origins-and-producers`: so much pressure - 3:35 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I'll try to get to the bottom of it and then let the coffee wordsmith write about it... teamwork - 4:05 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I'd love to explore indonesian coffees more - 4:28 PM `#origins-and-producers`: pretty legit cherry selection from pepe Attachments: - [VIDEO-2026-06-08-18-49-08.mp4](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078447734456415/1513912682464415764/VIDEO-2026-06-08-18-49-08.mp4?ex=6a36a38e&is=6a35520e&hm=73046bd033afc50f61a8ccf0b7a362c3ae829ba6303c6a9e816c21b72f8e73c1&) (video/mp4 576x1024) - 4:37 PM `#origins-and-producers`: you're beautiful - 4:38 PM `#origins-and-producers`: you are beatifulist - 4:41 PM `#origins-and-producers`: you and <@839279408057024512> can do this 😂 - 4:45 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hahaha don't say nuttin bad bout chiroso... <@1504523316864749676> will find you - 4:57 PM `#origins-and-producers`: sample roasting your lots this afternoon hopefully ### 2026-06-10 - 12:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Cupping is the best - 12:13 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i'm hoping soon we'll do some kind of 'public' cupping again... it might be more advanced/and industry focused... but, we'll see - 12:15 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: id' want to do something more interesting than just cup sey coffees. anyone can do that at home if they want... i'd currate it a lot more with all the fing samples i have... let people taste stuff they normally would never be able to taste - 12:17 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ha i just don't want to do beginner cuppings... so i need to figure out how to do only advanced stuff without getting yelled at - 12:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah - 12:19 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: haha this is kinda the problem is like how you do define 'advaned' - 12:19 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: This checks out - 12:24 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: this is certainly a goal! - 12:30 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i cup all the time with baristas - 12:30 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: thats not what i'm personaly talking about - 12:31 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i want like a community like actual advanced cupping - 12:31 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah - 12:32 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: properly good coffee tasters coming together.. like Sey House but more focused... producers, green buyers, roasters, enthusiasts... maybe some baristas get there... but more like actually collaborating / doing work... not education focused - 12:34 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ha I' am other lance - 12:35 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: are you the famous football player? - 12:35 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: please tell me your the famous football player - 12:38 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I'm bad at the internet, are being for real right now? - 12:39 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah like this.. this sounds amazing - 12:46 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: even with the most calibrated people in coffee... its never looking at each other and saying 'exactly' - 12:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: thats already going to happen - 12:48 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ha i'd argue that that is for a very different reason... but, this probably isn't the place for that conversation - 12:53 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: haha i love the wow list. I'm going to make one - 12:54 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ha well yes.. i'm just not sure how much i'm allowed to swear on this thing - 1:00 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: we can probably faciliate some of this... LH, myself, doug and Hao yung cup via zoom every other week - 1:00 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: its obviously very important for work... but could open it up maybe once a month or something - 1:00 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: its just challenging getting everyone the exact same coffee, roast batch, EY, water, table placement hahaha its a lot - 1:06 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: it would be interesting... we approach these cuppings way more objectively because its work. For example... someone might have a preference for Ethiopian coffees and someone else might not love Burundi profiles... but I still expect them to know what a properly good Burundi profile should taste like and score it/ talk about it appropriately... same with Chiroso, same with Pinks, Geshas, etc.... - 1:11 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: this is kinda what i'm kicking around - 1:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i haven't gotten the seaweed thing in this coffee which i do in other kenyans... but other than that.. this is a very similar experience that I have with this coffee - 1:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: thank you so much for sharing... its a really interesting coffee so i'm interested to hear peoples experiences - 1:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah this - 1:14 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: for maybe the first time ever i might agree with carl - don't screen shot this - 1:16 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i'll kick it around... I'm sure LH would fully be down haha.., I just need to think about it a little - 1:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i mean, gotta have at least a little gossip... - 1:20 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: every call i have with suppiler - 90% talking shit, 10% okay cool, so how were the samples - 1:28 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: You should try cupping more 😂 - It equally demystifies - 1:29 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: blind cupping bowls don't lie - 1:30 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: 11.5g coffee 200g water 1.3 target tds Our QC water i believe has been posted 1000 times over the internet.. but can share again if helpful - 1:30 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: hah people who know can also know by how one talks about coffees - 1:31 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: nay UL cups perfectly fine... if its cereal in a cupping bowl its cereal brewed... aint no one has ever brewed cereal out of a coffee in my experience... I'm fully open for somoene to prove me wrong - 1:32 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: you do have to grind it finer - 1:32 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I don't know i'm still confused about this one - 1:32 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: finer, agitation fs things up - 1:33 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: or at least too much agitation - 1:34 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: blind triangulations will fool the best of people - 1:34 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: they are very, very good. Also, heres one for you <@189881407399657472> set up 5 latin coffees blind, identify them. then leave the room and have someone mix up the bowls and try to identify them again - 1:36 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: we do this but we do it with 20 coffees... ha i'd start wth 5 - 1:36 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: haha watch Lance embarrass himself live, on the internet - 1:37 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: its very, very good - 1:37 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: once you get comfortable there.. do it with 5 washed ethiopian coffees.. if you can do that, i will be veru impressed - 1:38 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ha its so hard - 1:38 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I've been meaning to go taste wine with the som at 11 madison park... i just haven't had time for it. I will get around to it thogh - 1:39 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: leader board is so tough though cause its fully random levels of quality and roast - 1:39 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: and processing - 1:40 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah exatly that - 1:42 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: this is an insane thing to say - 1:45 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I think we have a lot to learn from wine... i'm not entirely sure how or where the cross over is.. but, regardless there is stuff to learn there - 1:45 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I also need to go on a wine buying trip... i really want to talk to wine makers about terroir with people who can taste it really well - 1:46 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i think we have a lot to learn about acidity and cherry maturation from wine production - 1:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: but to say a somm is more impressive than a coffee taster is just properly crazy ha - 1:48 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: if anything, and i'm fully unqualified to make this claim... but i'd guess the opposite. simply because coffee isn't alcoholic... we can taste wayyyyyyy more coffees at a time than they can wine - 1:50 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: also the lot seperations we taste in coffee are way way way smaller and more precise than wine. I can taste coffee from one tree against a coffee from the other tree. Our 'nano' lots would make wine producers lose their minds. But, they are way better at defining what they are tasting and blending... We will 100% start playing with blending process soon... something like 10% estalla nat with 40% estalla honey with 50% estalla washed... something like this - 1:50 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yes also this for sure - 1:51 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah its super interesting - 1:52 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: hahaa yeah that coffee was legendary - 1:52 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: we did blend it - 1:53 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah also just a super fun process - 1:53 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: okay i have to go sample roast jose's coffees ha - 10:19 PM `#current-menu`: definitely not sub coffees this go around - 10:19 PM `#current-menu`: Sometimes we will put smaller, expensive lots into subs.. but not these ### 2026-06-11 - 12:32 AM `#1513307859658477568`: Higher quality green, if that means more uniform physical, then yeah, they roast significantly more uniformly. As for crashing, this has more to do with moisture content, and for whatever reason, Kenyan coffees always crash crazy hard... - 12:33 AM `#1513307859658477568`: ha oh no - 12:33 AM `#1513307859658477568`: with the right batch sizes though you can really plan for it and roast through it very well - 12:34 AM `#1513307859658477568`: at least on a loring - 3:49 PM `#origins-and-producers`: personally I absolutely love this profile and find it to one of the most unique profiles in all of coffee. hate to disagree 😂 I'm team <@952039663680512030> - 3:50 PM `#origins-and-producers`: First sidra i bought was lugmapata circa 2015? I can't even remember - 3:52 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Not sure how La Palma got it... but we do know sidra came from the nestle lab in ecuador and was first disributed within Ecuador... now its obviously all over the place. Esnaider Ortega has a really really beautiful one. - 5:10 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hahaah I also loveeeee the eucalyptus like profile - 5:12 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Gerald update - honey 7 days on the drying beds Attachments: - [WhatsApp_Image_2026-06-08_at_09.11.14_1.jpeg](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078447734456415/1514648596765605988/WhatsApp_Image_2026-06-08_at_09.11.14_1.jpeg?ex=6a36adee&is=6a355c6e&hm=1a40c6092af8df36143355ca1da3e60eaa70af310dc7258f63ed2a36af1feb1a&) (image/jpeg 1200x1600) - 5:23 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hahah fingers crossed... this is a fun way to let everyone else experience the joys and sorrows of coffee buying.... getting so excited just for coffees to be defective or 83s 😂 - 5:25 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yellow Caturra is abolutely the variety that as shown the highest potential in Northern Peru in my experience... with the obvious exception of some geshas - 5:48 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: nah, if we release a yellow caturra it will be identifed as yellow...but that has bee one of the better caturras i've tasted in a minute - 5:49 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: its so so hard - 5:53 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: this farm produced the higest scoring pacas lot in honduras for like 5 years in a row - 5:54 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: this farm, el guayabo, bitalina lopez... these produced insane pacas lots for a a number of years ### 2026-06-12 - 4:00 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Ethiopia - depends on the region, in Gedeb it's more landrace. In Sidama what we're working with is amost compltely 74158 - 4:00 PM `#origins-and-producers`: As for Sudan Rume.. I've never actually tasted one from a farm that has genetically tested it. So, no idea! - 4:08 PM `#origins-and-producers`: flavoring coffees... I mean i think about this as.. it is what it is... if someone likes it amazing, if it helps a produce make more money, amazing. People love them and produces love making them, so why not? I think a move diverse world is a more interesting world. Ha I'll never buy one, and I personally don't like them... but, if everyone thought about coffee the samea me, again - boring world. Where I do get a little more opinionated is that most of the flavored coffees are very easy to make and don't actually require high quality cherry/coffee/variety/ etc... So, at the top of this industry, brewing comps etc, why are these coffees raising to the top? and 90+ washed coffee is without question the hardest coffee to make and requires the most skill and highest quality coffee/farming practices etc. So, why does a flavored coffee cost more money than a 90+ washed coffee?? - 4:10 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I've done a lot of actual co-ferment tests... with like passion fruit and mango and stuff... it actually only imparts a very, very mild flavor to the actual coffee. I can't say with certainty but, i'm pretty sure to get these insane flavors they are just adding artifitial flavoring to the tanks... but more than anything, the lack of transparency is what makes things challenging - 4:32 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i mean, i guess? this is probably more a personal opinion and some people probably care more than others... for me, flavoring is flavoring... whether is 'natural' or not doesn't really make a different to me. But, I could definitely see some people where that would be a meaningful distinction - 4:36 PM `#origins-and-producers`: it does just seem like a missed opporunity for producers and the industry though.. for me transparency is everything... if a producer wanted to dry their coffee with herbs and jasmine flowers or whatever... honestly i'm here for that ha... i love co-ferments in fruit wines and beer... they can be so fun. It just has to be honest... and I do know that 90% of what is 'co-fermented' or 'infused' is just x flavor 9847 flavoring... - 4:37 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah for Juan Zapata i think of it more as like quality of fruit, its very bright, very fresh, leans tropical and also tart.. .kinda gooseberry ish or something along those lines - 4:42 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ha i'll clarify by saying 'i'm here for that' means i think its way more interesting than adding flavoring... can't say I'd actually ever be interested in buying one ha... But, its more to say that transparency is everything so people know what they are getting. - 6:19 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I don't know nor have I experienced any adding of flavors in Ethiopia.. Definitely long anaerobic fermentation times though - 6:20 PM `#origins-and-producers`: This is extremely difficult to map. If you're interested you should pick up and look at Tim Hill's book on Ethoipian coffee varieties! I work a lot with Tim in Ethiopia specifically. - 6:21 PM `#origins-and-producers`: haha I don't know.. lots of people claim to have it.. I haven't tasted a clean version of it ever, and I've never seen genetics on it. Certainly not saying its not real. I just haven't seen it - 6:22 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yes exactly.. .They use a ton of pressure to help this process... but, lot of it is flavored... I personally know this to be true. But, i also don't feel like its my place to publicly call out specific producrs - 6:39 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Tim shoud have send you that sample - 6:39 PM `#origins-and-producers`: oh wow thats amazing - 6:41 PM `#origins-and-producers`: haha tim just sent me a sample of what he considers to be an example of 8 out of 10 level of flavoring - 6:43 PM `#origins-and-producers`: it smells like a bergamot Potpourri explosion - 6:51 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ha no this one is the one christopher just recieved - 6:52 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I think its infused, tim doesn't think its infused, now were gonna get <@421132246536159232> 's opinnion on the matter ha - 6:53 PM `#origins-and-producers`: but it raises some kind of interesting questions if producers will start really, really subtly flavoring coffees - 6:54 PM `#origins-and-producers`: hah oh yeah probably.. didn't even think of this - 6:57 PM `#origins-and-producers`: this discord actually makes sample roasting infinatey more enjoyable... now i get to sample roast and chat coffee at the same time - 6:57 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ohhhh i just did this - 6:57 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: let me know what you think - 6:58 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Tuke Yute Basha Mate Milled smaples ready for flying - 6:59 PM `#origins-and-producers`: physical is basically perfect on them.. so we'll see how they cup, then approve them put em on a plane.. hopefuly they cup out well ha - 7:00 PM `#origins-and-producers`: tyoxy can def in that profile... can also lean tree tomato though as wel.. which i also personally love - 7:02 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah i think of blackberry as the best of kenyan profiles (for me) or coffees I personally talk about as 'Kenyaesk' profiles.. can definitely find these profiles in Pinks from huila and pepes tyoxy - 7:03 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: for sure, the second harvest changed alotttt from the first harvest - 7:05 PM `#origins-and-producers`: <@421132246536159232> is working on a way of actually testing this.. But, i'll obviously let him talk about it - 7:05 PM `#origins-and-producers`: of course! - 7:05 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah, so cool - 7:05 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah exactly - 7:08 PM `#origins-and-producers`: smart people doing smart people stuff - 7:09 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: did it change the quality of the fruit? - 7:11 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: this is actually mostly different plots and elevations... also different parts of the branch... cherries mature at differnet times (pocho at nuguo did one of my favorite exiriments where he only harvest cherries from the center of the branch that ripened perfectly uniformily into a single lot) But, as green buyers we usually think of the 'peak' quality as mid main harvest... but, we've until now, not really ever separted out the harvets before to taste the differences... but most farms have an early, mid and late harvest - 7:16 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Honestly, we're trying to answer alot of these questions by separating out the harvests... I personally am still learning a ton and still have a ton of questions - 7:16 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: haha yeah, i've seen alot of cool separations in coffee but when pocho told me about that one.. i was was like whoa.. thats cool ah - 7:17 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: he also did one where he only harvested from the center of the tree... so nothing from the top of the tree or the bottom - 7:17 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah, super fun to taste - 7:17 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: these were differnet years unfortunately - 7:18 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: His theories had more to do with where he felt nutrients were going on the tree... - 7:20 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: haha i mean its pocho so its a lot of rain magic... haha but he also know a fuck lot about coffee.... i think he was testing an idea that energy and nutiants start in the center and move out - 7:23 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i mean its always been hella hella obvious to me... and there are certain processing words that raise hell red flags.. if theres a word in the processing that is like 'what does that mean.. i.e thermal shock... its. apretty good indication that its been f'd with - 7:23 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: ha yes, hes the best - 7:24 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: went on a hike through nuguo with pepe and pocho last year... coulda just died happy after listening to them talk about farms and nature - 7:25 PM `#origins-and-producers`: in processing? - 7:25 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i've heard of sous-vide in roasting expiriements but not in processing - 7:25 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i see no issue with trying to control temperature in fermentation though.. if thats what their trying to do - 7:26 PM `#origins-and-producers`: all the other words in that stress me out way more than the sous vide part haha - 7:30 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: yeah 2 and 3 are much more similar - 7:30 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: i got more intense berries in the second harvest though.. more citryus in the 3rd - 7:32 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: do you grow fruit? - 7:33 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i haven't found the transparency or profiles/qiuality that i'm personally looking for from the Hachi project - 7:35 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: will you take me here next time i vist out west? - 7:36 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: sounds lovely - 7:43 PM `#origins-and-producers`: just got arrival notice that arrived at port Attachments: - [Screenshot_2026-06-12_at_1.42.38_PM.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078447734456415/1515048835846508754/Screenshot_2026-06-12_at_1.42.38_PM.png?ex=6a36d12e&is=6a357fae&hm=3f52e6ec72d49eac34dd694cb62c201078e2268b36794c4c5e5cecd22da65a40&) (image/png 472x300) - 7:44 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ha i mean i did.... - 7:44 PM `#origins-and-producers`: wil be fun to taste them against the bed dried - 7:45 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: this coffee is so so lovely - 7:46 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: hah yeah, i love when coffee gets that red... really starts to make it look and taste more like juice - 7:47 PM `#origins-and-producers`: haha we'll try to do an SL9 separation from Kamavindi next harvest... no one knew it exisited on the farm for the last harvest - 10:04 PM `#origins-and-producers`: wouldn't you like to know - 10:05 PM `#origins-and-producers`: oh yes, ha i read this as 'inca gesha' ha womp - 11:04 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ecuador in harvest as we speak Attachments: - [image.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078447734456415/1515099610417336330/image.png?ex=6a3657b8&is=6a350638&hm=aa262ba7c8f3d1f73070ced674c5a39c38e83172ad658b8b8e44266595e55c69&) (image/png 1600x1200) - 11:05 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ha sorry carl. but no, the asnwer is definitely no - 11:06 PM `#origins-and-producers`: we'll be flying in 6 new lots in the next few weeks.. plus hopefully a tyoxy lot.. if pepe an make one - 11:06 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I'm curious how and why you feel like you can answer this if you don't actually know? - 11:07 PM `#origins-and-producers`: otherwise its just spreading misinformation - 11:10 PM `#current-menu`: we're constantly tasting other roasters coffees. I'm curious how you're measuring the color? All of our coffees are between 135 and 140 right now on the difluid color track because that is as light as we can roast them without cereal.. most things (with a very few handful of exceptions) taste cereal any lighter than 140. Also any coffee roaster ligher than 140 we taste cereal on. And believe me when I say we taste ALOT of coffees roasted over 140 from other roasters. But, its just away we are calibrating and defining development and taste - 11:10 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah same - 11:12 PM `#current-menu`: our coffes do tend to be more soluble than other roaster.. so what you're perseiving as 'dark' could be higher strength tds... - 11:16 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Ecuador harvests vary a lot throughout the year throughout the country... we basically have lots coming in all the time from Ecuador... but that's also because we're flying coffees in in very, very small lot sizes straight off beds. Most entire countries don't have a 3 month main harvest in central and south America... they have this more in Africa.... Ethiopia and Kenya specifically. - 11:21 PM `#current-menu`: if experienced cuppers are tasting roast on our coffees.. i'd really love to know... table bias can be very, very real... so I'd certainly ask for proper due process obviously. but if you put 5 coffees that taste like cereal at 145 on a table with 1 coffee roasted at 140 - that 140 coffee will absolutely taste dark... But, if you reverse this the coffee at 145 will taste completely of cereal. so its important to make sure you're doing proper due dilagence with coffee evaluations - 11:25 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Oh no, what you said about ecuador harvest is fine, if qualified with a 'in my opinion' or a 'from what i've been able to learn' or something... But, to say something that is blatantly wrong as fact is just extremely misleading for alot of people that also don't know the actual answer. For example if someone asks me a question that I know christopher or whoever will know more about than me, I'll ping them to speak about it. Or I'll say i think x y and z but someone else might know more about it than me. But it gets challeneing to continue meaningful conversation when people are talking about something that is actually wrong... like if the conversation had continued that ecuador is not actually in harvest.. that whole conversation is wrong. - 11:26 PM `#origins-and-producers`: we all just need to be careful and aware of what we know and don't know.. what is our experience, subjective preference or what is reality /fact... ecuador in harvest or not in harvest isn't a subjective opinion - 11:27 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I hold myself to this same standard - 11:28 PM `#current-menu`: not targeting more solubilty... i think that is actually just the nature of properly roasted coffee.... I'm activly working on trying to figure out how to roast into the 145s without cereal... its just realy really hard - 11:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: someone asked if ecuador is past harvest - you said yes. This is the context... saying otherwise is gaslighting. - 11:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: thank you for this ❀ - 11:32 PM `#origins-and-producers`: absolutely! but we also need to be able to hold each other accountable... id ask you to do the same for me - 11:33 PM `#origins-and-producers`: haha no worries.. and yes there are definitely 'main harvests' for each country... although climate change is reallyyyyyyyyyy starting to mess with this in central and south america - 11:34 PM `#origins-and-producers`: https://www.cafeimports.com/north-america/blog/harvest/ Certainly isn't perfect and each year changes... but it gives you the idea - 11:35 PM `#current-menu`: cool yeah, thanks! i can also reach out - 11:38 PM `#origins-and-producers`: sure! hit me up - 11:38 PM `#origins-and-producers`: el nino is going to completely destory Colombia this year... potential - 11:40 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah... it could get really really rough... still hoping though - 11:40 PM `#origins-and-producers`: this harvest currently happening in Huila right now will be good... but the next one is definely in question - 11:47 PM `#origins-and-producers`: not till next harvest! - 11:47 PM `#origins-and-producers`: which actually means hes in harvest right now... we should seee his coffee landed in the fall fingers crossed - 11:47 PM `#origins-and-producers`: i'd love to answer... which producers specifically? - 11:51 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah totaly, i taste his coffee every year... its been pretty hit and miss for the past 3ish years. He has definitely produced insane coffee in the past. Some of this I believe is part of the new mill that is milling his coffee potentially... but its very challenging to know exactly whats going on. But, i do cup it every year - 11:52 PM `#origins-and-producers`: ha the ticuna lots are fun and awesome and small and veryyyyy much a passion project of Kyle and Jose the owners of Osito - 11:54 PM `#origins-and-producers`: this i personally believe in quality flucuations within a country. 3 years ago was a abolutely lengendary year in Colombia for Pinks... like they were in sane... the next year, good but not as good, then even worse... I think this year or the next year we'll see that cycle go back to insane quality Burundi is the most extreme versions of quality cycles - 11:55 PM `#origins-and-producers`: haha Copa is a bigger and more complicated conversation for me personally... but, some of that is definitely roasters/judges pushing those producers to ferment more and hold in cherry more, which is obviously not the profiles i'm personally looking for - 11:56 PM `#origins-and-producers`: My highest scoring Pinks over the years have been Wilson alba, Servio Botina, Octavio Rueda, and Arles Galindez... but that is because I personally am really looking for the more 'kenyaesk' profiles in Huila/Pinks - 11:56 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I absolutely love them and think they are so so so special - 11:58 PM `#origins-and-producers`: yeah i taste through all the copa lots every year, we were i think maybe the first buyer of copa lots along with passanger? i think...? ### 2026-06-13 - 1:45 AM `#1515118804202422343`: I personally don't know anyone in coffee buying lands that use SCA protocals - 1:47 AM `#1515118804202422343`: my experience is that scoring coffees is only effective within a tightly calibrated group. IMO this doesn't really exisit at scale. It might actually exist more within commodity coffee... but I have very little/zero experience there. [[#Index|Back to index]] ## lancehedrick ### 2026-06-08 - 12:13 AM `#origins-and-producers`: You having issues? Can discuss in the brew tab - 12:27 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Made it - 12:31 AM `#filter-focused`: Roast date? - 12:32 AM `#filter-focused`: Yeah I recommend 4 weeks for the Ethiopia for sure. - 12:38 AM `#current-menu`: Which recipe? - 12:54 AM `#1513307859658477568`: đŸ”„đŸ”„đŸ”„ - 12:55 AM `#current-menu`: Can dial in loads of diff ways depending on pour speed and proximity with kettle but ofc brew what tastes best! I opted for this as a go to because it is easy to explain and people can manipulate it and always get solid to exceptional cups. - 12:56 AM `#current-menu`: Doing what I know most People enjoy in cup, usually around 4.5 on zp6 for it. For me, closer to 5 or higher with more agitative final pour - 12:56 AM `#current-menu`: Pretty gentle on the double blooms and then blast away final. - 12:56 AM `#current-menu`: But some like going finer and just pouring gentle whole way thru - 12:57 AM `#current-menu`: I can promise the recipe goes hard with zp6. Just about finding the grind size x pour pattern best for you and your taste preference - 12:57 AM `#current-menu`: But again! If you found something you love- no need to change just to have another recipe lololol - 12:59 AM `#current-menu`: I never really change my water. I'm weirdly purist. Crazy changes to water takes away for me the intricacies of coffee to coffee. Like seasoning the coffee with artificial flavor almost. NOT SOMETHING I PREACH lol This is a weird mental thing I have So i always do just the SEY house/UL recipe Never deviate - 1:01 AM `#current-menu`: (Not against tailoring water! Just not for me, though it obviously massively changes taste and I'll do it if trying to understand hype with a coffee) - 1:01 AM `#current-menu`: Oh I didn't feel called out lololol - 1:01 AM `#current-menu`: This is a recipe we recommend at SEY. All data is helpful - 1:02 AM `#current-menu`: For sure. This would be another approach the recipe is open to. Hence me not giving grind size - 1:03 AM `#current-menu`: Same here - 1:04 AM `#current-menu`: But that is not everyone's cup of tea 😉 Some want more punchy and will sacrifice complexities/ potentially allow astringency. - 3:12 PM `#1513307859658477568`: typhoon roasts *can be* incredible. But, as feran rightly pointed out, they break down often - 3:12 PM `#Brew-Along`: brew with me ;) - 4:15 PM `#Brew-Along`: brew with me ;) - 10:19 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Lol - 10:29 PM `#origins-and-producers`: The zeitgeist and yearning for high EY was def due to scott rao and the belief better grinders and better coffees can be extracted more. Coffee is good, grinder grinds well- push it. Interestingly, before this, rao himself was quoted by hoffmann as saying 13-15% extractions were actually remarkable. We now know there are specific gradients with which specific VOCs release during extraction. Once you hit 22 and up, you are almost invariably hitting higher concentrations of more bitter compounds and lower of the ones we seek (ones that contribute to floral and fruit notes). More needs to be done on this as the trends are mostly shown with chromatography in espresso, but nevertheless, it revealed what people had been tasting- compounds come and go by temp, time, heat, extraction. And they come out at specific points based off these. Can see more with Smrke role of fines in espresso extraction. - 10:30 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Whoops sorry. Realized this is origins and producers. Wrong thread for this lol - 10:41 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Meh. Cupping is overrated - 10:41 PM `#origins-and-producers`: 😝 ### 2026-06-09 - 5:02 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Duber so good - 5:03 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Cup with me <@952039663680512030> - 8:03 PM `#current-menu`: Flat beds are fake news lol ### 2026-06-10 - 10:58 AM `#filter-focused`: I can make insanely good soup on met. - 3:59 PM `#filter-focused`: I cannot get away from more hollow cups with such small doses. I have done very similar recipes to this. Hollow can be seen as clarity, I guess, but for me it seems like there are nice florals on periphery but nothing in the middle, speaking visually. But, taste and perception is extremely subjective. And anything is valid lol But yeah- I stick at the 20-22g threshold because below that I get hollow. Even the best cups I have produced are not giving me more florals or complexity or punchiness. They may give something simialr, but in the periphery with a hollowness I cant jive with. But, again, my experience and others may try and adore. - 4:10 PM `#filter-focused`: For sure. I guess I was moreso giving my side of why I disagree the ceiling is higher with tiny doses. I do not find that to be the case. I can mimic the good from small doses with bigger ones without the negative. - 4:17 PM `#filter-focused`: Regardless, taste is subjective. Perception is subjective. We just here tryna taste yummy soup. - 4:19 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Super floral. Nice but tame citric presentation. Banger for sure. - 4:22 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: needs 4 weeks for sure - 4:22 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: cutie patooties - 4:25 PM `#Brew-Along`: la brew brew - 5:34 PM `#Brew-Along`: la brew brew ### 2026-06-11 - 12:17 AM `#current-menu`: Ok let's take a cool down - 12:18 AM `#current-menu`: All around - 12:20 AM `#current-menu`: How about that duber tho - 12:20 AM `#current-menu`: Still tasting pineapple from the brew earlier on live lol - 12:21 AM `#current-menu`: From bermudez - 12:22 AM `#current-menu`: Banned - 12:22 AM `#current-menu`: Thanks for heads up on that - 12:25 AM `#current-menu`: Kamavindi - 12:25 AM `#current-menu`: 😅😅😅 - 12:25 AM `#current-menu`: Nah. Potentially going to peru to see these 2400m+ farms. Hope it works out - 12:27 AM `#current-menu`: We have 4 coming. The best there is đŸ„° Stoked - 12:32 AM `#current-menu`: So many genetic testing being done - 12:33 AM `#current-menu`: Exciting times. For nerds - 12:34 AM `#current-menu`: 34 and k7 are both Ethiopia legacy so would be chill lol - 12:55 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Once we have better understanding, we will - 1:01 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Very precise. My first intro to sidra was LPET. I actually competed with a lactic washed sidra in 2018 brewers - 1:02 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Soledad and Gertrudis def made sidra more of a household name as regards Ecuador - 1:04 AM `#origins-and-producers`: 1000% - 1:09 AM `#origins-and-producers`: 2018 lance in comp with sidra lololol Attachments: - [Screenshot_20260611_000758_Instagram.jpg](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078447734456415/1514406069869482155/Screenshot_20260611_000758_Instagram.jpg?ex=6a3674cf&is=6a35234f&hm=1d0fcba696fab2fe73bd3a974baed95ae8951a8f8cd7477353b8d8fcf1d3a51d&) (image/jpeg 1080x2340) - 1:14 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Typica đŸ€Ł - 1:15 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Sidra often has like a green element about it i dont love. Eucalyptus or something - 1:16 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Not if minty - 1:16 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Teehee - 1:32 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I do not. So long ago haha. 8 years! Might be able to find my script somewhere - 1:33 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Tho tasting notes I usually handwrote morning of the comp - 3:58 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I know you are. Haha you can keep the eucalyptus taste all for yourself. I'll take the other botanicals lol - 10:39 PM `#current-menu`: Done - 10:40 PM `#current-menu`: Quick tag me and I'll ban asap ### 2026-06-12 - 1:30 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Doubtful they would make something to be compatible with other accessories - 1:30 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: But the step down i am helping with will be nice - 1:31 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Dual wall stainless good enough? Lol - 1:33 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: But also way out of the potential scope of a massive company like oxo lol - 9:05 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Going by preference of taste is always a win - 9:16 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Just soak in cafiza - 11:12 PM `#current-menu`: They are actually darker. Only a couple of h and s have been slightly lighter *editing- they are same level. Had to check notes. Misspoke. Our lighter ones match their baseline. - 11:13 PM `#current-menu`: I rest TPC and Substance 2 weeks - 11:13 PM `#current-menu`: Lol - 11:13 PM `#current-menu`: Not sure where the edict for long rests for light roasts came from. Roasters also dont think this đŸ€Ł - 11:15 PM `#current-menu`: I can stream more cuppings for unfiltered immediate reactions, but only maybe three times have i blindly scored another roaster on a table over 88. Beside our coffees, which i also go into blindly. So many are green issues or underdeveloped OR over outside and under center. We cup about equal parts other roasters and us each table. - 11:17 PM `#current-menu`: Tbh what i have been most disappointed by with *most* has been past crop - 11:17 PM `#current-menu`: Always a couple of exceptions to every rule, of coursr. - 11:18 PM `#current-menu`: Yeah to get things so light one has to underload and max power and that very often leads to over/under. - 11:21 PM `#current-menu`: If course depends on coffee. I have measured a walnuts at 132 - 11:21 PM `#current-menu`: Was typing this out haha. - 11:22 PM `#current-menu`: Table bias for sure. Or calibrating to understand grain =light which is also not ideal. I have tasted with many that make these equals - 11:23 PM `#current-menu`: This can also be due to what lance is saying about solubility. But also, it is coffee to coffee. The Emiliano lane from.shoebox was great at 2 or 3 pour. - 11:24 PM `#current-menu`: For sure. Was just saying bean to bean. Like the danche white honey from us is more needing heavier approach than Marlene, for example. With shoe durley and lane are diff - 11:24 PM `#current-menu`: Absolutely can smell it - 11:27 PM `#current-menu`: I wish there was a way to collect data from people on what they taste and how they taste. From the limited tastings I have had with others over a variety of roasters, there is a specific grain note I am confident people taste and automatically attach to UL. I am not here to judge whether they enjoy that note or not. I think because we do not want it in our coffees, it makes it sound like we villainize. But that grainy taste overtakes a lot in the cup and gives a very myopic presentation of aroma and acidity imo. But, this is based off people brewing coffee they brought me at SEY house and wanted to brew in their way or when I visited people or cupped with people. So v limited, but it has been the case each time. Grain presence = UL = "more defined aromatics" - 11:28 PM `#current-menu`: Difficult thing to do publicly even if unbiased due to it being blind. Lol - 11:29 PM `#current-menu`: I would be v curious if you repeated this 5 diff times what the readings were. I have had some do this and the readings would skew up or down up to 5-8. If this happens, means you need to go finer than chirp and be more careful in prepping the sample. - 11:30 PM `#current-menu`: This is something i (and many others I have chatted with) have actively tested. I have never had grain rest out of a coffee - 11:31 PM `#current-menu`: I'll talk to Luca. Im good friends. - 11:31 PM `#current-menu`: I have cupped wth him multiple times. In person and online lol - 11:33 PM `#current-menu`: I think that is simply due to the fact intensity of flavor, whatever it is in the coffee, eill wane over time. - 11:33 PM `#current-menu`: That isnt a question - 11:36 PM `#current-menu`: Love max and they make some bangers - 11:36 PM `#current-menu`: So does h&s - 11:37 PM `#current-menu`: Just to ensure my rhetoric is not skewed lol That ameliano lane gesha was nice. And the gitesi from h&s - 11:41 PM `#current-menu`: Same for me lol - 11:41 PM `#current-menu`: Which is why lance and I have been shy going too far. Grain tends to dominate - 11:41 PM `#current-menu`: *in my experience* - 11:42 PM `#current-menu`: Weird saying Lance because I have never known another. Feels like talking in 3rd person. - 11:43 PM `#current-menu`: Might just be the dope green the producers be making! Magiccccc - 11:43 PM `#current-menu`: (Edited out "our" because possessive is weird) - 11:53 PM `#current-menu`: For the sake of Carl, when I say "lighter" or "darker" I am referring to objective metrics that refer to the color gradient of a coffee. I'm sure there are ambiguous understandings of what constitutes a light vs a dark roast, but something that is subjective is not helpful in conversation. We have been trying to be transparent in how we are approaching our coffees and part of that is trying to relay facts. Agtron is not an end all be all, but it is pretty damn close to reflecting reality. So, with that has been said, take jnto account it is a mixture of blind cupping and color readings. - 11:56 PM `#current-menu`: Did not mean to start anything. I know you are not a fan of color so I added context - 11:57 PM `#current-menu`: And gave an explanation as to why we use that here in discussions. A slice of objectivity is necessary to meaningfully discuss. We do take all the convos here seriously, tho! That is one of the main points of starting this discord. - 11:57 PM `#current-menu`: Apologies if starting with your name made it seem abrasive. - 11:58 PM `#current-menu`: Was not the intent! - 11:59 PM `#origins-and-producers`: First three are my top 3 over past few years. Crazy. And wilson had multiple bangers. Wild consistency. - 11:59 PM `#current-menu`: Heard! ### 2026-06-13 - 12:01 AM `#current-menu`: I do understand there are two main ways of understanding light vs dark. One is a taste reaction (brown vs not brown, for example). Another is the objective lightness or darkness of the ground sample. The former is good and is noted in our blind cuppings, but carries little to no weight as we all perceive flavor differently. The latter helps place us in a spectrum that has proven to be pretty consistent overall. - 12:02 AM `#current-menu`: Yeah I would not say we are where XLiii lives, for example. Some of our stuff touches some of their's but their baseline is def lighter. - 12:02 AM `#current-menu`: I still say we are on the upper end of "extralight" if I were to categorize while we dip our toes in with some coffees in UL on the lower end (like danche WH) - 12:02 AM `#current-menu`: 100% - 12:03 AM `#current-menu`: I have helped actually a handful improve protocol and it changed their results drastically. - 12:03 AM `#current-menu`: Some that read darker than others began to read lighter haha. - 12:04 AM `#current-menu`: The most important things are grinding everytime super finely. Ensuring the surface is super flat and matte. Taking a couple readings to ensure no deviations beyond roughly 0.5. Then, next time you read, keep a couple samples from last time to read again and ensure you are at same exact grind size. - 12:04 AM `#current-menu`: The self calibration even if not touching the grinder is important AF - 12:05 AM `#current-menu`: Even with nice grinders. There can be a smidge of drift when grinding so finely. - 12:05 AM `#current-menu`: Overall The coarser you go, the more variance The less consistent the top layer is, the more variance - 12:06 AM `#current-menu`: Of course. Color is for lightness and darkness. It is not seen by us and hopefully others as a way to legitimize a roast approach - 12:06 AM `#current-menu`: Not sure i have met a roaster that focuses only on color tbh - 12:07 AM `#current-menu`: That would be wild. Haha Understanding it is a tool to know limits is what is important. - 12:08 AM `#current-menu`: Also, should be noted that the only sensory data we do have with regards to this is that end color has the closest correlation to enjoyment by a consumer..meaning, the *likelihood* is higher drinking a 140 coffee regardless of how it got there if you tend to enjoy 140s over a 130. Not a guarantee but the tasting data suggests a strong correlation. - 12:08 AM `#current-menu`: Not that this means color is more important but that it *is* a helpful metric - 12:10 AM `#current-menu`: Hahaha heard. I am in this convo and origins tab. And a text thread. - 12:10 AM `#current-menu`: Just responding to things out of context as that is what discord is yeah? Haha - 12:13 AM `#current-menu`: Would need to heavily edit the notes since they have other roasters in there lol - 12:13 AM `#current-menu`: But I dont personally mind popping my blind tastings somewhere - 12:20 AM `#current-menu`: Ugh fine. I'll ask forgiveness later rather than permission now. - 12:21 AM `#1515118804202422343`: <@189881407399657472> get us started - 12:22 AM `#1515118804202422343`: Lololol - 12:22 AM `#1515118804202422343`: I just had my lab built (meaning ikea crap installed) Cupping about to go crazy - 12:22 AM `#1515118804202422343`: [attachment only] Attachments: - [IMG-20260612-WA0004.jpg](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1515118804202422343/1515119152468066334/IMG-20260612-WA0004.jpg?ex=6a3669eb&is=6a35186b&hm=591fc02473f781557a9bb76aa7c8ac13c41505f8792631f7a8a3a19852aaa001&) (image/jpeg 2048x1536) - 12:22 AM `#1515118804202422343`: So many bowls can fit on that table. - 12:23 AM `#1515118804202422343`: This is the way - 12:23 AM `#1515118804202422343`: Or, have someone send you the coffees only labeled with a letter and number, set up and cup. - 12:23 AM `#1515118804202422343`: This is how I cup everytime i get coffees from SEY hahaha - 12:23 AM `#1515118804202422343`: Idek what our coffees taste like prior nor the other roasters in the set - 12:24 AM `#current-menu`: Lololol allowed - 12:24 AM `#1515118804202422343`: It is super fun. And helpful. Love guessing the coffee. - 12:24 AM `#1515118804202422343`: Tho most of my time is on critiquing. It is like a diff approach to tasting altogether. Brain works differently lol - 12:25 AM `#1515118804202422343`: Instead of what is calling me in this cup, it is what could be better/what is shit - 12:25 AM `#1515118804202422343`: Bit more negative but tryna ensure tasty treats for the peeps. - 5:42 PM `#current-menu`: To wrap up the color chat- we are not trying to be UL. We are trying to roast in a way that we believe represents the coffee as purely as possible. Whatever color that comes out to, great. Are we trending lighter and see the benefits of lighter roasting? Absolutely. But the discourse here is less to see who can roast the lightest (which is quite simple- 20% load and yeet) but what we are actively doing in a transparent way for you all that follow along with us. Our goal first and foremost is to purvey the best green in every region we touch. Secondarily, it is to showcase said green without f*cking it up. The way we are doing that has been evolving as we have been tasting and experimenting. The idea here is to give you all a better understanding as to decisions made and potential shifts within presentation. And, of course, to read the discourse. Considering the profound effect psychology has on cup interpretation and enjoyment, we feel sharing the narrative could help those who enjoy the coffees we release would benefit from the knowledge, a peak thru our window. Tldr- not trying to be UL, not trying to be lightest, not trying to compete- trying to present the wonderful green we purchase as well as we can to what we perceive as the most rigid cup quality standards. (As I assume most roasters attempt!) - 5:43 PM `#1515118804202422343`: [attachment only] - 5:57 PM `#current-menu`: With the green we have coming in, hopefully the fire continues to build! - 6:18 PM `#current-menu`: Yep. Which is why i keep trying to bring up and emphasize our priority is being a purveyor of green, sourcing the best from every region we visit. And I do firmly believe we do that. - 6:19 PM `#current-menu`: In fact, I asked to work *for* SEY. They did not approach me lol I wanted to be a part of what I saw as the most exciting green buying program in the world, what with all the jars other Lance has his fingers in. It is absolutely flooring to be here. - 6:19 PM `#current-menu`: Zero question there. - 6:23 PM `#current-menu`: Some even higher farms we have not touched. 2400m+. Will be super interesting - 6:25 PM `#current-menu`: All the exact reasons I reached out and told Lance and Graham I wanted (read- needed) to work with them haha - 6:39 PM `#current-menu`: Sorry! Haha loadsssss Lance recently posted about kenya arrivals - 6:41 PM `#current-menu`: Raining tasty - 9:15 PM `#filter-focused`: 1min or more bloom for fresh coffees always a good play ### 2026-06-14 - 8:23 PM `#water`: Pavlis works just fine. It is just 45ppm KHCO3. Goal is really just to save espresso machine. No corrosion from too soft and no scale. Can always post mineralize to taste. - 8:24 PM `#water`: Tbh, perhaps I am inept at tasting espresso, but I have not been able to consistently tell the difference in espresso with fluctuation on GH as little as 10ppm. Hence post mineralization as needed. - 8:36 PM `#water`: Nah. I have not. - 8:38 PM `#water`: Dont quote me but if you find weirdness with K can probs do NaHCO3 with same/similar benefits regarding machine maintenance. But im not a water focused chemist like pavlis so dont quote me lol - 9:02 PM `#water`: Side note. Brewed coffee already has 800-1300mg/L of potassium. Adding 45 is not going to make a discernible difference. Thats a teeny percentage. - 9:02 PM `#water`: Chatting with someone else now about potassium and figured id come add that fun fact - 9:03 PM `#water`: And even higher for espresso. Up to 3000mg/L in a recent paper - 9:16 PM `#water`: Disagreement is cool. Would be stoked to taste thru it with you at some point. - 9:17 PM `#water`: But there are loads of potassium ions in coffee already, which is interesting. And it isnt just one paper. This is common knowledge. Just different numbers over the years depending on coffee roast level and brew method. - 9:18 PM `#water`: I dont doubt you taste something. I would be skeptical if it was K. But we certainly do not know everything. Weird stuff happens. I just have not been able to taste the diff in, say, 5ppm NaHCO3 5 KHCO3 vs 10KHC03 - 9:19 PM `#water`: (Meaning 10 vs 10, just one mixed) Cool that you can and would be amped to join, seriously. You in bay area? I WILL make it out there for a big meet up. - 9:58 PM `#water`: Yet another reason. So many legends out there. - 10:32 PM `#water`: I dont care about competence. I care about the passion. Tasting with competent people is not inherently fun. Tasting with passionate people is a blast. What i see in bay area is a crazy amount of oozing passion (not to say there is not competence lol) - 11:02 PM `#water`: You must be bay area - 11:02 PM `#water`: 😅😅😅 [[#Index|Back to index]] ## opp4004 ### 2026-06-08 - 12:55 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Looks like somebody finally figured out the secret recipe 👀 - 1:22 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Watching my roaster friends suffer is a constant reminder that if I ever end up working in coffee, I will absolutely, positively, under no circumstances become a roaster đŸ€Ł - 1:32 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Wilson Alba is a good example. When SEY started splitting coffees by harvest period and releasing them separately—El Porvenir might have been one of the first examples?—I honestly thought it was mostly a marketing gimmick. But after tasting enough of them and seeing how different the cups could be from one harvest window to another, I’ve reached the point where I actually look forward to those releases. That aside, I used to be a huge fan of the Pink Bourbons from San AgustĂ­n. But at some point I started getting the same feeling I get with Ecuadorian Sidra: ‘this is excellent, but a lot of it is starting to feel familiar'.. By contrast, producers from Palestina—like Wilson Alba—keep surprising me. The range of flavors is just enormous. I forgot to describe the cup itself. I'm getting intensely brewed hibiscus, a touch of herbal character, sour candy, and tropical fruit. It actually reminds me a bit of Kenyan estate coffees, but with a lighter texture and a much more aromatic presentation. The body is less dense, yet the fragrance feels even more intense Attachments: - [IMG_1262.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1513324774917673181/IMG_1262.JPEG?ex=6a367a46&is=6a3528c6&hm=f09aec3e636efb83f0512a0beffc0f17646eb648b3899f805a6c06a75db6b07b&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 2:34 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Haha, back when SEY was absolutely obsessed with Pink Bourbon, I ended up tasting everything from the first harvest through the fourth harvest. And here's the funny part: every single one tasted different. I tended to prefer the later harvests. There was something about them that felt more complete and expressive to me. I've had a similar experience with Kenyan coffees as well. Once, I tasted two lots from the same coffee that differed only in the milling process, and the difference in the cup was surprisingly large. Experiences like that really drive home one of the most fascinating things about coffee: factors that seem almost trivial on paper can have a huge impact on flavor. Harvest timing, milling, storage, drying details—sometimes the smallest variables end up producing dramatically different cups. - 2:36 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Back then, it honestly annoyed me a little. I'd look at the release and think, ‘Oh... another Pink Bourbon. And this time it's just a different harvest date. Right. Anything else?’ 😂 - 4:12 AM `#1513307859658477568`: I guess Manhattan is the only Typhoon roaster I've had coffee from so far. Still, I've definitely noticed more roasters talking about switching to Typhoon these days - 4:13 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: This is my favorite Attachments: - [IMG_0232.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1513365321837445130/IMG_0232.JPEG?ex=6a36a009&is=6a354e89&hm=2fd2301336bcc986c5ab1bd52e2c99c2d333084636faf42d4cb116f26235d675&) (image/jpeg 2048x1535) - 4:14 AM `#1513307859658477568`: I'm curious about the IMF. I've had both really good and really bad experiences with coffees roasted on it. At this point, I'm starting to wonder if it mostly comes down to the roaster rather than the machine itself - 4:44 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: At this point, my recommendation would be to look for Geshas from Peru or Colombia - 5:39 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Looks like we're about to have a fight over UL... better go grab some popcorn - 5:58 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: The coffee I'm drinking right now is from a Chinese roaster 'Coffeebuff', which I think is pretty solid. Among the Chinese roasters I've tried, I'd put Big Sur, AOKKA, and Coffeebuff in the group that not only roasts well but also buys green coffee exceptionally well—though personally, I'd still put Big Sur at the top This one is a Kenyan natural distributed by Kamavindi. Tbh, I feel like Kenyan naturals are a bit of a recurring illusion for me—I keep convincing myself this will be the one, and somehow I fall for it every time As for the cup itself: it's definitely on the fermented side, but I happen to enjoy that style. I'm getting mulberry, raspberry, pink grapefruit, lychee-like tropical fruit, and a sharp, sparkling sweetness and acidity that reminds me of passion fruit. There's also a touch of floral character in the background It's a Slow Dry Natural, so the profile is noticeably more intense than what I'd expect from a typical natural process. Attachments: - [IMG_1263.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1513391795747164292/IMG_1263.JPEG?ex=6a36b8b1&is=6a356731&hm=abce3552e0c84f0b08e10fb5ffc41d134d58625a2944eff640a3bb38ad7f3f00&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 6:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: One of the most memorable coffees I've ever had - 6:02 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I loved it so much that I bought an extra bag and froze it. That's my emergency reserve for a very special day - 6:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I was genuinely shocked by how it tasted, ha.. - 9:36 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Glad to hear you enjoyed it. You can adjust the intensity just through grind size, and if it still feels like something is missing, try raising the water temperature little by little. I tend to judge by the appearance of the brew. If the cup feels a bit too clear or transparent, I’ll usually increase the water temperature. If it feels too dense or heavy, I’ll lower it slightly. - 10:40 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I haven't measured it exactly, so I'm not sure... maybe around 400–500? - 3:37 PM `#Brew-Along`: I think 2–3 weeks of rest is usually enough. By that point, most of the coffee's flavors seem to be there - 3:39 PM `#Brew-Along`: Honestly, I sometimes drink coffees that my friends send me when they're less than a week off roast, haha. I don't usually have a strongly negative reaction to them - 3:41 PM `#Brew-Along`: Resting does tend to simplify the flavor profile a bit, haha. It makes the coffee feel more settled and composed, what resting won't do, however, is turn a bad coffee into a good one, that's been my experience - 3:44 PM `#Brew-Along`: Haha, now I feel a little self-conscious... Anyway, other people often talk about the chemical changes that happen after roasting. The explanations can sound pretty convincing, to be fair - 4:07 PM `#Brew-Along`: OXO Rapid Brewer is great for soup, but I honestly think it's just as good—if not better—for making non-bypass style coffee. Especially if you skip the tamping - 4:10 PM `#Brew-Along`: That's exactly why I keep the water temperature unusually low with the OXO - 4:25 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Surely Peter's secret sauce had something to do with it - 11:13 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Edid Medina, Boneya Robe, and Juan Pablo Ortiz coffees from the subscription? - 11:14 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Great - 11:14 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: đŸ„ł - 11:24 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I’ve heard this year’s Chorso Bule is exceptional - 11:39 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I love high-altitude Sidama coffees, but I’m just as excited about the high-altitude Gedeb lots this year - 11:41 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I’ve only had natural-processed high-elevation Gedeb coffees this year. They were a bit on the classic side, but
 - 11:42 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: They weren’t as clean as Sookoo ### 2026-06-09 - 12:02 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Oh basha - 12:03 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: And Mate đŸ€Ż - 12:03 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Bishan dimo was legend - 12:06 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: It’s honestly so nice to see Demeka Becha again. It’s basically the reason I started chasing Ethiopian coffees in the second place, haha. Ah, Catalyst
 I wonder if Emily is still handling coffee as beautifully as ever - 12:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: If I remember correctly, most of Mofa Forest ended up in China last year. This year, though, I’m starting to see it show up in the US as well. It was a pretty good coffee, from what I remember - 12:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Hearing that makes me even more excited... - 12:50 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I’ve never actually spoken to Emily directly, but I’ve heard she’s genuinely very serious about coffee—when you buy from them, she’ll often follow up quite thoroughly asking how the green was. It really shows how much she cares about it - 12:55 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I'm currently drinking a coffee from the El Tablon de GĂłmez area in Nariño—produced by smallholder farmers in that region. It feels like Colombia has been increasingly moving toward building and marketing these community-based lots more than before. They’ve always done it to some extent, but it definitely seems more active now. Interestingly, when this coffee first came in, some people even suspected it was flavored because the aroma felt a bit artificial. Anyway, the cup itself is quite distinctive. There's a mix of lychee and pine-like freshness, some peach and lime, that molasses-like residue you often get with Castillo, and this almost ‘artificial blueberry’ note. Probably because of the Castillo, you still get those strong tropical fruit and blueberry-like impressions. It actually reminds me of the old El Placer Castillo
 which I kind of miss (and yes, I forgot to take a photo again) - 1:09 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah, it’s washed. When it first came out, people kept asking whether it was flavored—it still feels a bit like a mystery, honestly. - 1:11 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I can't remember the exact name, but there was a pretty hyped Colombian Geisha—Villa Alejandria or Bella Alejandria, something like that. It was dried together with tangerine peels during processing. The coffee I'm talking about feels quite similar to that. It gives me the impression that fruit is being dried alongside the coffee during the drying stage. Lately in China, I've noticed this kind of processing often gets labeled as ‘advanced XX’—which is kind of funny. - 1:13 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: They even ended up showing photos of it being dried together with lemongrass later on, ha - 1:14 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: So Colombian coffees don't really have the best reputation in Korea... unfortunately. What's even more interesting is something I heard from Renjifo—that in the end, it's the green buyers who actually choose to source mostly those kinds of coffees đŸ€Ł - 1:16 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Still, if I taste coffees from the real pioneers in that space, they're not necessarily bad at all. It's just that a few producers take it to an extreme. People like Jhoan Vergara or Edwin Norena, for example
 sometimes it's good, sometimes it's not. But I wouldn't want to drink that style as my main coffee - 1:17 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Anyway, it's a bit unfortunate that even the Lasso brothers' coffees are now being viewed with suspicion - 1:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: đŸ€Ł - 1:23 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah, I get what you mean - 1:24 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Those kinds of processing experiments are already being done quite heavily in places like Vietnam, China, and India—especially with robusta. And apparently the results are fairly positive - 1:24 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Though I've heard some of the ones from India—like Ratnagiri—can be pretty terrible - 1:27 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Well
 I still get the impression that those kinds of coffees sell pretty well - 1:38 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I agree. Some of those coffees feel like they would shine more as traditional washed lots, but they still go for these experimental processes for some reason - 1:44 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Guess there are limits based on variety, and in some of those regions Gesha doesn't even grow that well. So I assume it's partly a strategy to either add value or position the coffee at a higher price point. I've also tried a Chinese coffee that was made in a style reminiscent of Moutai—the expensive liquor, haha. It wasn't actually bad, but it was extremely fermented in character - 1:45 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: This isn’t something unique to China—can see similar trends in places like Thailand and Myanmar as well. It feels like they're trying to overcome those limitations in their own way, but it doesn't look easy. In a way, I think planting entirely different varieties—like what Nicaragua has done—might be a cleaner solution. But realistically, that takes a lot of time.. - 2:08 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: The time when Takesi was around $25–30 for 120g felt like the most reasonable pricing - 2:08 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: At least Intelligentsia used to be under $50, ha - 2:10 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I don't think it was this expensive when GGET released it last year - 2:14 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: San Isidro Labrador in Costa Rica is one of the places I personally rate very highly for Gesha, and even there the prices aren't anywhere near that level. Even in Bolivia, farms like Senda Salvaje or Finca Isabel—at least in my opinion—are better than Takesi, and they're probably close to half the price. It really makes me think about what i'm actually paying for when a farm becomes ‘famous’
 - 2:15 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: And I already know the answer to that one—just subscribe to SEY, ha - 2:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Subscriptions do have their advantages—like better inventory turnover, for example. Anyway, I've just decided to enjoy it for what it is - 2:26 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah, I get that. Asian pear, a bit of oolong-like texture, tropical fruit, candy-like sweetness—those kinds of notes can show up in both washed and natural coffees. At least that's how I perceive it. I tend to prefer when processing stays a bit more restrained and focused on origin character. So I do feel a bit of regret about that direction - 2:29 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: That said, one important thing to keep in mind is that in China, many coffee-growing regions were originally tea plantations, and in many cases the infrastructure hasn’t changed much from facilities designed for tea storage and processing. What that means is that, intentionally or not, those ‘tea’ elements inevitably influence the coffee—whether it's during cherry handling or parchment drying. I've noticed a somewhat similar impression in other Catimor-producing regions like East Timor or Honduras, Nicaragua, and more, but what stood out in China was how that tea-like background seems to layer itself on top of Catimor in a very distinctive way. It comes across as quite unique. But locally, there seems to be a stronger preference for more extreme, experimental processing—which is a bit of a shame, in my view. - 2:36 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: From here on, this is more of my own observation and hypothesis—but I think the way tea is evaluated in China is fundamentally different from how coffee is evaluated in most Western specialty contexts. In other words, rather than favoring highly fruit-forward profiles, there seems to be a greater appreciation for what we would often describe as ‘negative’ notes in coffee—nutty, roasted, or even more savory, grain-like characteristics. So I think there’s a kind of mismatch in sensory preferences here.. China also has a strong cultural preference for fermented foods, and I suspect that plays a role as well. As a result, coffees that go beyond what we would consider the ‘balanced or optimal point’ in roast or fermentation often appear more frequently. - 2:38 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Interestingly, Taiwan sits on almost the opposite end of the tea preference spectrum compared to mainland China, and that tends to reflect in their coffee as well. So Taiwanese greens often develop in a direction that aligns more closely with what we tend to look for in specialty coffee, even if they're still somewhat limited at this stage. - 2:39 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Of course, this is just based on my limited experience, so I wouldn't take it too seriously, haha. It's more of a synthesis of my own impressions along with thoughts from people around me who have spent a long time exploring tea. - 2:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Conclusion: Catimor is actually pretty delicious, for me đŸ€Ł - 2:49 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: (That said, Catimor itself has a huge amount of variation
) - 3:23 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah, I think that tea-like character comes from the terroir shaped by tea cultivation. Around Yunnan and nearby regions, the borders are quite fluid in a cultural sense, and it's hard to clearly define the influence as belonging to a single country - 3:24 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Southern Yunnan and the surrounding regions share a lot in common - 3:36 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: However, Thai coffee probably feels quite different from Yunnan, and I think that comes down more to quality differences - 3:37 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: There’s a certain profile you often get from Thailand and Myanmar, and sometimes Laos as well—usually coming from Typica. That sort of tobacco leaf, savory, almost earthy character. I think it's largely a quality-related issue - 6:34 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I'm drinking Bursa Coffee's Muntasha right now. It's a natural-processed 74158, but what's interesting is that it went through a ‘cold underwater fermentation’ process. As far as I know, that's the processing style that started with Totumas and later gained some popularity. It definitely comes across more positively to me than a typical natural. The cup is remarkably clean, with excellent clarity and separation between flavors. In the cup, I'm getting ume plum, delicate florals, very ripe peach, and tropical fruits reminiscent of lychee and mangosteen. It may be a little short on complexity, but the flavors are so vivid and well-defined that it never feels lacking. Attachments: - [IMG_1279.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1513763102749884496/IMG_1279.JPEG?ex=6a36c100&is=6a356f80&hm=0804e138030a0d9ba0c5e27f411c3728a700c2c46fad5caef43b33701b2ff89a&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 3:28 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I think Coffee County is probably the best roaster in Japan when it comes to sourcing green coffee - 3:31 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I've been keeping an eye on Hana - 3:34 PM `#origins-and-producers`: like Space too. Especially the Java Halu lots they've been working with. I've been wanting to try them for quite a while.. I'm currently trying to figure out a way to get my hands on some—maybe I'll have to convince a few friends who import coffee to help me out. - 3:36 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I'm genuinely very interested in the more advanced processing experiments coming out of Indonesia these days. I loved the fully washed Java I had from Apollon's Gold a while back, but recently I've started seeing coffees processed with things like ‘vacuum processing,’ which has really caught my attention - 3:37 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Among Asian coffee-producing countries, I think Indonesia is the one that either has already succeeded—or is the closest to achieving long-term success - 3:38 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Of course, I know how good truly fully washed Indonesian coffees can be. They're not always easy to find, haha, but that's part of what makes them special.. I'm optimistic about Indonesia's future. I think it's going to do very well - 3:40 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Back when some of my friends were obsessed with Malaysian Liberica, I even started looking into Liberica from West Java as well. Have you ever tried it? - 3:42 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Excelsa—I'll keep that in mind, haha. I saw some being grown and sold in South Africa once, and the price was absolutely crazy - 3:45 PM `#origins-and-producers`: The one I had was a fully washed Java variety from Wahana in Sidikalang. It was one of the most memorable coffees I've ever had. Ever since then, I've been chasing fully washed Indonesian coffees - 3:57 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I'd also love the chance to try some of Indonesia's more mythical varieties—things like Abyssinia and a few others I've always been curious about - 3:59 PM `#origins-and-producers`: CATIMOR - 4:02 PM `#origins-and-producers`: That's one of the reasons I love Indonesian coffee - 4:07 PM `#origins-and-producers`: That said, there might not be many coffees you'd enjoy these days.. The most shocking processing experiment I've seen recently was someone trying to recreate kopi luwak through yeast inoculation. It feels like most producers are moving toward carbonic maceration or co-ferment - 4:10 PM `#origins-and-producers`: What's even more interesting is that I tried a mango co-fermented coffee from Java Halu—a farm that's actually quite well known for doing co-fermentations. And somehow, I barely perceived any fermentation character at all - 4:12 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Generally speaking, coffees from Sumatra and Aceh can consistently reach around the 86-point range. They're usually quite solid. As for the rest... well, a lot of it comes down to luck - 4:13 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I've heard that producers around Ribang Gayo Musara and the surrounding area have been making a serious effort in recent years - 4:14 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Honestly, the biggest challenge with Indonesian coffee isn't the taste itself—it's the massive amount of defective beans. These days, if I know a producer has a color sorter, I feel a lot more confident. Otherwise, it's often a gamble ### 2026-06-10 - 1:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Verified by the gatekeeper? 😎 - 1:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Cupping sessions: half coffee evaluation, half secret negotiations. Maybe a little gossip too - 1:34 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Review in progress: Copa de Oro Western #1 Attachments: - [IMG_1283.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1514050156721602572/IMG_1283.JPEG?ex=6a367ad7&is=6a352957&hm=20e86023206b638c7362a6c4b36b1e709905022dbde5b3f8da6bb70a72d46677&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 1:38 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I tried doing a leaderboard once, and that was enough for me. Blind tasting drives me insane - 1:39 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: from Doan - 1:40 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Exactly. You'll be sitting there thinking, ‘Wow, they completely messed up this roast,’ and then you reveal the coffee and it turns out to be an Ethiopian decaf - 1:41 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Doan is selling some coffees right now, but by the time you get around to ordering, they'll probably be offering something completely different - 1:44 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I've actually been fooled before. It turned out to be the exact same Karimikui roasted by the same roaster, but one came through a subscription and the other was bought locally in person. I was convinced one of them was a Rwandan coffee - 1:48 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: That's a dangerous statement, ha - 1:49 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: But honestly i kind of agree - 1:50 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Personally, I'm a bit skeptical of evaluations from people whose palates are heavily shaped by alcohol. So... - 1:56 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Looks like something interesting happened while I was asleep... - 2:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah - 2:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I've never seen anyone call South Korea ‘SK’ before, haha - 2:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Cool - 2:04 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Anyway, I'm currently drinking the 1st Place winner of Copa de Oro Western: San Jose, a Gesha variety. I'm getting notes of pineapple, soft chamomile beneath the pineapple, gentle lemon-like acidity, a delicate musky aroma, and a touch of herbs. The coffee was roasted just yesterday, so it's not exactly exploding with aromatics yet, but it's already showing a lot of promise. Even at this stage, it's a very good coffee. - 2:06 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: The roaster is lurking here too... but I'll leave it at that, haha - 2:06 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Copa de Oro is such a great competition. To be fair, it's not quite as exciting as it used to be now that Geshas are everywhere, haha. But seeing varieties like Aji show up reminds me that it's still a competition worth paying attention to. - 2:09 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: These days, they all seem pretty similar, even the coffees that come through Korean retailers have been quite good. - 2:09 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Aji is a really interesting variety - 2:10 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I do wish Lance would bring in more Aji, ha.. Then again, I suspect a lot of people would hate it if he kept releasing coffees that taste like chili peppers - 2:11 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: chili - 2:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I still haven't gotten my hands on that yet... Maybe one of my friends has a bag. I'm not sure. - 2:14 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Hmm
 maybe chiroso just tends to taste like that in general? ha - 2:16 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I had a bit of a bias going in because William Ortiz is from the Pitalito region—you know, given some of the well-known names from that area like the Lasso brothers. But it turned out to be completely the opposite of what I expected. He actually produces really clean coffees - 2:17 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I kind of think the Lasso brothers are the main ones responsible for ‘weird coffee’ spreading around that region
 ha. Though to be fair, that's more of a cupping-table kind of gossip - 2:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: đŸ˜¶â€đŸŒ«ïž - 2:31 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Well
 starting around summer 2024, it’s true that the intensity of flavors did seem to ramp up. I assumed there were some internal decisions behind that change—especially since I’ve repeatedly heard feedback that some of the producers supplying SEY were leaning a bit underdeveloped. Personally, I didn’t really have a problem with it. I just saw it as a matter of taste. So for me, it never felt like an issue—just a stylistic preference - 2:43 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I guess I should’ve joined the discord a bit earlier - 2:45 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I joined after seeing LH promoting it, haha. SEY really hired someone good there - 2:57 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Haha, go buy more Big Sur! - 2:59 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I’m looking at Hyunah, and Triple is still on sale? That’s surprising - 3:00 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Triple Fermentation isn’t really what most people think it is
 - 3:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: If I said it's basically a similar process to the Danche or Chorso lots SEY is selling
 would people actually buy it? ha - 3:02 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: That’s my chinese dream đŸ€Ł - 3:03 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Mohamed Aba Nura is one of the few successful single-producer projects from Jimma - 3:04 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Of course, I’ve always considered Kuma one of the most underrated roasters - 3:04 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Very, very underrated - 3:17 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Buy more OXO, thank you - 3:21 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: This used to be my setup Attachments: - [IMG_0169.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1514077114289356800/IMG_0169.JPEG?ex=6a3693f2&is=6a354272&hm=2a83d57d239eb6f80a9db6551c9f08112dd8e721ca2b1ec05d5d8ee9d1735ddb&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 3:22 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah, that’s not a bright, light-style roast. Still, they do coffee well - 4:25 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: No smoking, no alcohol, regular exercise—no food rituals before coffee, and no coffee on bad mood days - 4:27 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I think not smoking is the most important thing - 4:29 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: And also taking care of your nose - 4:29 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: In the end, it all just means staying healthy - 6:53 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I think this is my sixth time drinking a coffee from Octavio Rueda. His coffees have always been good, but this one is shockingly floral. I'm getting a honeysuckle-like floral note intertwined with fresh strawberry, a refreshing herbal character that seems to cleanse the palate, buttercup-like florals, stone-fruit notes reminiscent of loquat, elegant earth-rose florals, and the sweetness of ripe mulberry. I generally don't like making direct comparisons between coffees, but this one reminds me remarkably of Gachiku, which I drank recently đŸ€Ż - 6:53 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: [attachment only] Attachments: - [IMG_1288.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1514130430498963637/IMG_1288.JPEG?ex=6a36c599&is=6a357419&hm=aa276fc7260bf6ee48f04f3bc2d6c356f0e1d23f370b4d8748e40c7d6acfc663&) (image/jpeg 3024x4032) - 2:48 PM `#filter-focused`: [attachment only] - 3:14 PM `#filter-focused`: It's been updated. Don't pump it quickly anymore - 3:15 PM `#filter-focused`: What I told you is actually the latest recipe - 3:16 PM `#filter-focused`: I'm curious to hear Doug's reaction - 3:16 PM `#filter-focused`: ORB magic đŸȘ„ - 3:17 PM `#filter-focused`: Oxo Rapid Brewer - 3:17 PM `#filter-focused`: everyone here just calls it ORB - 3:44 PM `#filter-focused`: A slightly easier-drinking recipe: 14g coffee Grind size: about the texture of coarse salt One filter on the bottom An AeroPress-style standard filter on top (optional, but if you don't use it, grind slightly finer), no tamping 240ml water 94–97°C Press the pump very slowly. Once you hear the gas escaping, you're done. This produces a lighter, more expressive cup with greater clarity and aromatics. That said, I think this recipe works best with a conical burr grinder. - 3:46 PM `#filter-focused`: My impression is that the 22g recipe has a higher floor, while the 14g recipe has a higher ceiling. The 22g version is incredibly dependable and produces a consistently satisfying cup. The 14g version is a little more sensitive, but when it works, it can be exceptional. These days I'm mostly brewing the 22g recipe because I have far too many coffees on hand and want to get through them efficiently. Historically, though, I spent much more time with the 14g recipe. - 3:49 PM `#filter-focused`: No TDS measurements—just my tongue and nose 😂 - 3:53 PM `#filter-focused`: The whole point of my recipe is simple: easy and delicious. That's always been the goal. From the Tricolate to the NextLevel and Pulsar, now on ORB... that's been my approach all along - 4:02 PM `#filter-focused`: Yeah, that's right. The biggest drawback is that the texture can feel a little hollow at times.. That's one of the reasons I always use an stainless filter on top. It seems to help a bit with that. As for the 14g recipe, I don't really use it for reviews or evaluation. It's more of a ‘turn my brain off and enjoy the coffee’ kind of recipe. It's not analyzing the cup—It just enjoying - 4:03 PM `#filter-focused`: Rather than following the progression of flavors and aromas, I just enjoy whatever pops out at each moment - 11:28 PM `#filter-focused`: Yeah ### 2026-06-11 - 12:19 AM `#current-menu`: 👀 - 12:30 AM `#current-menu`: I guess I’ll go brew a Kenyan coffee too.. - 12:35 AM `#current-menu`: And they even found moka - 12:44 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I don't think that's been fully confirmed yet. That said, after the Kenia incident at Herbazu in Costa Rica, and seeing some of the SL28 lots that were identified afterward, my assumption is still that it's probably SL28 - 12:45 AM `#origins-and-producers`: ...or they could all just turn out to be K7 - 12:47 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I think the situation is that what we currently call SL28 probably includes multiple distinct genotypes grouped under the same name. If you look at the Herbazu case, they distributed it as SL28, but it was later identified as Kenia rather than the established SL28 type. That makes me think there may be more than just K7 mixed into what has historically been labeled as SL28. In other words, I suspect ‘SL28’ has sometimes functioned as a broad field designation rather than a single, genetically uniform variety - 12:48 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Lance has been gathering SL28 samples from different producers across Latin America - 12:52 AM `#origins-and-producers`: One of Herbazu's ‘sins,’ if you want to call it that, is actually a fairly common issue in Latin America. A lot of varieties weren't introduced through genetic verification or certified seed programs. Instead, someone would say, ‘This is SL28—we brought it directly from Kenya,’ and the variety would spread from there. Then years later, genetic testing comes along and suddenly it turns out to be something else entirely. Pink Bourbon has gone through similar situations. In some cases, producers were convinced they had one variety, only for genetic analysis to tell a different story. There have even been cases where a variety was distributed as Gesha, but later turned out to be Sidra. - 12:53 AM `#origins-and-producers`: That's exactly why Lance is so committed to genetic testing - 12:56 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Honestly, it's just way too common in the coffee industry, ha. Long live genetic testing! - 12:59 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Sidra probably wasn't all that attractive from a pricing perspective in the U.S., especially when it was mostly associated with Ecuador. That may be part of the reason it stayed relatively niche for a long time. I think SEY offered some Sidra lots in the past, but the variety's early popularity wasn't really driven by Ecuadorian producers. If anything, many people first became aware of Sidra through La Palma y El TucĂĄn rather than Ecuador itself. Back then, it felt like only a handful of roasters in the U.S. were actively featuring it—places like Bird Rock, and maybe Equator. It certainly wasn't as widespread or sought-after as it is today. - 1:03 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Before that, Sidra was the kind of variety that only the real coffee nerds seemed to know about. You'd occasionally hear whispers about producers like Maputo, and maybe a handful of roasters were quietly excited about it. It wasn't a variety that most people were actively looking for. It felt more like one of those insider coffees—the kind where someone would hand you a cup and say, "You have to try this." Honestly, it was probably something that people like George Howell were drinking and thinking, 'This is incredible' long before the broader market caught on, haha. - 1:11 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I don't think I've ever had a Sidra from Jose's farm... Oh wait, I have. Sidra Wave, lol - 1:16 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Long Miles isn't the only source of great Burundian coffee. There are Kibingo, Yandaro, Gahahe, Nemba, the coffees JNP works with, and plenty of others. Still, Ruvumu was a name I'd never heard before, which made me a little nervous. Honestly, if you put this coffee in a blind tasting, I'd never confidently call it Burundi. Peach, an oily mouthfeel, eucalyptus-like florals, a touch of bergamot... just read the notes. This thing is basically Ethiopia. What it reminds me of most is Yirgacheffe. The florals are that distinctive. Attachments: - [IMG_1295.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1514407855472508968/IMG_1295.JPEG?ex=6a367679&is=6a3524f9&hm=be2f738cb6adf591ac008445588d77e7fb957ab494ed4592d188eaa8fe4c2fd6&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 1:22 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Ngozi is nice region, too - 1:35 AM `#current-menu`: I haven't had SEY's Chorso yet, although I could probably try the Chorso that's available in Korea if I really wanted to. I suspect it's the same coffee. As for Big Sur's triple, there's no question that I love it. That said, I'm not convinced it's objectively higher quality than some of the high-elevation washed coffees coming out of Gedeb. Personally, I think it comes down to preference. The reason I love triple isn't because I believe it's the best coffee on the table. It's because it reminds me of the kinds of coffees I used to enjoy years ago. There's a certain nostalgic quality to it that really resonates with me. - 1:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Well, Ethiopia is diverse, and Burundi is diverse too, haha. That said, if you tell most coffee people that a Burundian coffee tastes "like Ethiopia," you'll probably get some strange looks - 2:07 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Exactly. Years ago, coffees like this weren't all that unusual in Ethiopia. Before the overall quality level climbed so dramatically, there were plenty of washed Ethiopians that were a little less tea-like than what we often see today. They could be oily, floral, and sweet, with softer acidity and a rounder texture. Foge is one example that comes to mind. - 2:11 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Tbh i wasn't expecting that much from Danche. The first coffees they produced were incredible, but over time I felt that both Danche and Chelbesa went through a period where quality became less consistent. I've always jokingly referred to it as the 'Curse of Ethiopian fame', a washing station becomes famous, demand explodes, more cherries are purchased, production scales up rapidly, and eventually the average quality starts to slip. I felt the same thing happened with Demeka Becha for a while. What's interesting is that things seem to have improved significantly in recent years. The quality coming from many of these well-known producers and washing stations feels much stronger than it did a few years ago. As Lance often points out, higher prices seem to be translating into better quality. The premiums are finally large enough that producers can be more selective and maintain higher standards. - 2:35 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: A lot of people complain that Ethiopian coffee has become too expensive. Personally, I think the bigger story is that it used to be far too cheap. When i consider the quality that Ethiopia was producing, those prices were almost miraculous. Looking back, it's hard to believe some of those coffees were selling for what they did. At today's quality levels, actually think the pricing is fairly reasonable. Tbh, could even argue that some Ethiopian coffees are still undervalued relative to what they deliver in the cup - 3:25 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Time to invade America - 4:12 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I don't even know exactly what Kenia is - 4:12 AM `#origins-and-producers`: It could just be K7, ha - 4:37 AM `#origins-and-producers`: They might all be related after all - 7:40 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Now drinking: El Cerro, Yellow Caturra from Efrain Carhuallocllo Salvador in Chirinos, Peru. It's a Caturra, but I've had very positive experiences with other Yellow Caturra lots from Peru before—they almost reminded me of Yellow CatucaĂ­. I also loved Yulissa Chambi's Yellow Catuai from Bolivia and ended up recommending the green coffee to several friends. In the cup I'm finding aromas of cacao and white florals, along with gooseberry, subtle white currant, and a kaffir lime-like fruitiness. There is a slight cereal-like note in the finish, which may be related to the roast, but it doesn't come across as unpleasant. In fact, it integrates into the cup fairly well. Attachments: - [IMG_1303.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1514504463174602772/IMG_1303.JPEG?ex=6a36d072&is=6a357ef2&hm=254cc24da727463328185e727243674c2e9f7fe802c1445b244e6db12004c38a&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 4:00 PM `#origins-and-producers`: Haha, I haven't actually had that Sidra. That said, I've always loved the cool, almost chilling quality that Sidra can have. LH has mentioned that he doesn't like those eucalyptus-like aromatics, haha, but that's actually part of the appeal for me. What I find interesting is that Sidra from Lugmapata seemed to express itself a little differently. The same goes for Cruz Loma. They still had some of that distinctive Sidra character, but it felt less dominated by the cool eucalyptus note and showed a different side of the variety. ### 2026-06-12 - 12:57 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Unfortunately, I didn’t buy that 😞 - 1:07 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I’ll see if my friend has some and ask for a little - 1:34 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I'm drinking an Ecuador coffee right now — Las Palmas from the Lugmapata Neighbors Project. I think it might be the same farm that took first place in the 2024 Taza Dorada, beating Lugmapata. This feels significantly better to me than Lugmapata's Sidra. In fact, it brings back memories of the old Lugmapata, though with a bit more complexity. The cup opens with blood orange and that cool, unmistakable Sidra character. It carries the eucalyptus-and-sports-drink quality that I often associate with Lugmapata, alongside a layered complexity that reminds me of Moka varieties. I'm also finding notes of ripe peach flesh reminiscent of Ethiopian coffees, elegant oolong-like tea characteristics, and sweet, fully ripe grapes. The finish is long and refreshing, with a delicate tannic structure that gently cleanses the palate. Attachments: - [IMG_1315.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1514774900689076405/IMG_1315.JPEG?ex=6a367acf&is=6a35294f&hm=946b48d1bd741009a17f5d3040936d5299dea4b32fc9ea9762bc8350d817c576&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 1:55 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: <@1504622787422322689> Coffee from Lenin Flores, and Luna is currently offering it. I think Luna is a fantastic roastery as well—though they're also a roastery that really loves experimental processing, haha. - 1:55 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: https://enjoylunacoffee.com/product/lenin-flores-yellow-caturra-cajamarca-peru/ - 1:57 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Luna is definitely one of the roasteries that does an excellent job. That said, unless you're subscribed, their coffee turnover isn't particularly fast - 2:00 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I didn't know that, actually. P3000?! - 2:01 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: P3000 is definitely a dream roasting machine. But if I were a roaster, I think I'd probably prefer a 1kg Loring... I still haven't completely shaken my skepticism about Roest. Christopher probably wouldn't like hearing that - 2:07 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Exactly. Luna has always felt like a Diedrich-style roastery to me. Their coffees remind me of Drop during its golden years. That's why I'm curious about why they chose the P3000 - 2:12 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Speaking of Drop, I don't have anything against Stephen Leighton personally. In fact, I genuinely admire him. There's a tremendous amount to learn from his interviews, articles, and blog posts. That said, I feel that Drop changed significantly after he became involved, and unfortunately not in a way that resonated with me. I still respect him immensely, but the coffees—and the version of Drop that emerged during that period—just never connected with me the way the old Drop did. - 2:23 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Things like the roast quality, the price, and what people who've used it have to say about it - 2:25 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: The P3000 does look impressive. That said, there are still aspects of it that feel a bit like a toy to me, and I've also heard some negative feedback from people who've used one. I'm sure it has its strengths, of course. I just don't know if it's necessarily the best choice from a roaster's perspective. Then again, maybe that's because I'm not a roaster myself. - 2:26 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Of course, when I see Christopher and Luna using it, I assume they have good reasons for doing so. I'm sure they wouldn't be using it if they didn't genuinely believe in it - 2:28 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I suspect both Wilder and Sebastian rely on a bit of "magic sauce" in their processing. From what I've heard, Wilder uses a Chinese-inspired technique in which various materials are dried together with the coffee parchment during the drying phase. - 2:30 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: In Sebastian's case, there's a bit more information available about what he's doing. My understanding is that it's probably based on a similar principle to co-fermentation—essentially encouraging the formation of specific flavor precursors during processing - 2:31 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Ironically, a lot of Colombia's 'magic' producers have started releasing fully washed coffees these days to prove the quality of the cherries they're actually growing - 2:39 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeah, that's what I thought as well. A lot of the experimental processing I've been seeing coming out of China lately seems to follow that approach. There was a specific technical term for it, but I can't remember it right now. The basic idea is that you have parchment coffee on one layer, another material on a separate layer underneath, and both are dried together in the same environment. As for Wilder Lazo, the reason I bring him up is that he openly acknowledged it himself when his coffees first started gaining attention. First it was orange, then lemongrass, and so on. He explicitly said that those materials were dried alongside the coffee, which is why I tend to think in that direction - 2:41 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: In Sebastian's case, he mentions the use of 'fruit glucose' whether that should be considered infused or not is still open to debate. That said, if the fruit glucose contains fruit pulp or skin, it's entirely plausible that the yeasts naturally present on those fruits could play a meaningful role during processing. It's definitely a topic that deserves a more nuanced discussion. Wilder, on the other hand, is a different story. He openly acknowledged what he was doing himself, haha. At that point, there isn't really much left to argue about - 2:44 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: A lot of people have a negative view of yeast-driven fermentations, but even Esmeralda has used yeast in certain processes. When it's applied thoughtfully, the results can be surprisingly positive. Lost Origin has experimented with it as well - 2:45 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Of all the coffees that used yeast, Mikava has probably been the most impressive to me - 2:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Yeast is everywhere, after all. I recently came across a paper suggesting that, in coffee processing, the yeasts naturally present on the coffee cherries themselves are among the primary drivers of fermentation. The paper also discussed how insects may contribute to terroir by moving between coffee cherries and transporting microbial populations, including yeasts, throughout the farm ecosystem. - 2:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Personally, I don't think yeast is something worth obsessing over too much - 2:49 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Sure, there is a difference between relying on native yeasts and introducing external yeasts. But once you start asking where exactly the line between 'natural' and 'external' should be drawn, things get very complicated very quickly. After all, there is almost always some degree of human intervention involved. - 2:50 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: For example, what if a producer isolates yeast from the coffee cherries grown on their own farm, propagates it, and then intentionally inoculates future fermentations with it? Would that still be considered 'natural' or would it be considered an external intervention? Quite a few producers in Colombia are experimenting with exactly that approach these days. - 2:51 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Let's take this idea a step further. Imagine you're processing a Caturra lot, but during fermentation you bring in Gesha pulp or skins from another coffee and use them as part of the process. Would that be considered a problem as well? - 2:52 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Personally, I see all of these cases as being fundamentally similar. Human intervention exists on a spectrum, and everyone draws the line in a slightly different place. That's why I think the industry needs a broader conversation and some degree of consensus about where those boundaries should be. To me, that's one of the most important discussions happening in coffee right now. - 2:54 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: For what it's worth, I think the Lasso brothers are actually quite transparent about what they're doing. There are definitely some producers who are less forthcoming, haha, but overall the industry seems to be moving toward greater transparency. These days, most people seem to agree that producers should at least disclose what yeast strains or microbial cultures were used during processing - 2:55 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: In that respect, I think both Wilder and Sebastian are fairly transparent about what they're doing - 2:56 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Tbh, if you ask the producers directly, you'll usually get an answer. The funny thing is that it's often the roasteries that leave those details out, seriously. - 2:57 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: If I had to rank them in terms of transparency, I'd probably put importers first and roasteries second. Producers, honestly, would be at the bottom of that list. In my experience, farmers are surprisingly open. If you ask them directly, they'll usually tell you everything - 2:59 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Paraiso first - 3:02 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I really wish organizations like the SCA would take the lead on these discussions, but they don't seem particularly interested in it - 3:03 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: At the very least, there should be a protocol for testing these coffees when they enter competitions. Just look at what happened at the Best of Panama. Even now, we're still relying far too heavily on sensory evaluation alone, ha - 3:05 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Of course, there are practical limitations as well. Things like bioreactors, cultured yeast strains, and other fermentation equipment are often much harder to source locally than people realize. In reality, these are usually the kinds of tools and technologies that only larger, better-capitalized farms can afford to implement - 3:07 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: It's entirely possible that many of the excellent washed coffees we drink today are, at least in part, the result of practical limitations rather than a deliberate philosophical choice. That said, there are producers like Renjifo who genuinely prefer a more natural approach. He's the kind of person who pays attention to every detail, right down to the fertilizers he uses, and actively tries to maintain that philosophy throughout the entire production process - 3:09 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Ultimately, I think everything comes back to transparency. Whether consumers embrace these coffees or reject them is entirely their choice. The important thing is that they're given enough information to make an informed decision.What we want to avoid are situations where someone buys a highly regarded coffee, tastes it, and is completely blindsided because key processing details were never disclosed. In my view, that's one of the issues the industry is dealing with right now. - 3:10 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: (That said, I actually like yeast-processed coffees, haha.) - 3:13 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Well, there are a number of reasons. In El Paraiso's case, I remember hearing an explanation along the lines that there had been some kind of accidental leak or contamination. If I recall correctly, it was something related to propylene glycol. It's sometimes discussed as a carrier or medium that can facilitate the transfer or retention of aromatic compounds. - 3:14 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: The thing is, stories like these almost never make it into the market. That's what I would call a real lack of transparency, ha - 3:16 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: At the very least, people should be given enough information to understand what they're actually drinking. I still think we're falling short of that in many cases - 3:17 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: One of my friends has actually helped design processing protocols in Ethiopia, using yeast. I can't go into the exact details, but still... coffee processing is pretty fascinating - 3:18 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: So I think it's really about trying different things and experimenting. Whether the result ends up tasting good or terrible, ha - 3:19 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I hope it’s not viewed too negatively - 3:21 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Some people even call yeast itself 'infused' haha... I guess this is partly what happens when organizations like the SCA don’t really step in to clarify things - 3:22 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: That’s why I actually enjoy these kinds of discussions about processing - 3:23 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: From what I've heard from people actually selling these kinds of “infused” coffees, they often sell better than what you'd typically consider specialty coffee fan favorites. So in the end, it really comes down to money - 3:24 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Money money money - 6:17 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I'm drinking Big Sur right now — a single-farm lot from Faysel Abdosh in Welabo, Guji. I think this was the first release from that project. Flavor-wise, it's got this dense stone-fruit sweetness, a pretty classic black tea character, honeysuckle florals, bright tangerine, and a touch of lemongrass. It feels very 'classic Ethiopian' overall. But what I find interesting is that this kind of profile isn't something I usually expect from Guji. It's a really solid coffee, but it’s slightly surprising to see this expression coming out of that region Attachments: - [IMG_1320.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1514845970704105472/IMG_1320.JPEG?ex=6a36bcff&is=6a356b7f&hm=1715d6d58569407268e8611e0bda6fd17e70ae2f2e2432f15d86a0479566227f&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 6:20 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: When I think of washed coffees from Guji, I usually expect something along the lines of lactic acidity, subtle oolong-like tea notes, tangerine, tropical fruit sweetness, or occasionally more punchy, high-toned fruit expressions like raspberry or fresh strawberry. - 9:13 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I've literally never heard that before - 4:48 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Arboleda? - 4:50 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: There was a noticeable sense of fermentation in the cup
 It reminded me of those older Ethiopian washed coffees that went through long fermentation times, or dry-fermentation - 4:53 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I think it may have been influenced by some of the early processing work that David Berrio was doing - 5:00 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I don’t actually know that for sure. It’s just a guess. Urrao is a very small place, and everyone more or less knows each other, so it’s not impossible that ideas and techniques spread around locally ### 2026-06-13 - 12:05 AM `#origins-and-producers`: It feels like the direction of Copa de Oro has changed a bit over the years
 But it still seems to be one of those competitions where you can reliably find and access great coffees. - 12:07 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I’ve mentioned this a few times in my reviews, but at the moment, I think the Pink Bourbons coming out of Palestina are some of the most impressive coffees around. I’m especially excited for El Porvenir, which is coming in one of my subscription - 12:25 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I bought some coffees back in the Copa de Occidente days too! But the producer who took first place back then seems to have completely disappeared. I never see or hear anything about them anymore - 12:26 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Jose Fredy Rodriguez - 12:29 AM `#origins-and-producers`: No, that’s not him. He’s from La Plata - 12:42 AM `#origins-and-producers`: If we’re talking about coffee “magic,” China is probably leading the world right now - 12:44 AM `#origins-and-producers`: They say yeast was used, but with some of these coffees, I suspect there may have been aroma-carrying compounds involved as well—possibly something like propylene glycol - 12:47 AM `#origins-and-producers`: There was a specific compound associated with that peach-like aroma, but I’ve forgotten what it was, haha. The whole El Paraiso “Peach” controversy was actually a pretty big issue in Korea. As I remember it, the conclusion many people reached was that the coffee had been contaminated by leaked propylene glycol (PG). The testing also reportedly showed that certain aroma compounds were present at concentrations far higher than what would normally be found in coffee—if I remember correctly, some people were saying levels were over a thousand times higher than usual - 12:49 AM `#origins-and-producers`: This is - 12:51 AM `#origins-and-producers`: It’s still difficult to talk about publicly. There are a lot of behind-the-scenes stories that never made it into the open, and one importer in particular (not Coffee Libre) took a massive hit from the whole situation - 12:53 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Nowadays, pretty much everyone knows about it. But honestly, Paraiso 92 were an even bigger concern, ha - 1:01 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Ironically, after that whole episode, El Paraiso doubled down and kept pushing forward. They ended up producing legendary coffees like Letty and remained highly visible in the market. Paraiso 92 seemed to go the other way and became much more conservative - 1:09 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Now that I've had some coffee, I remember, ha Gamma-decalactone was the compound I was thinking of. It's often associated with peach-like aromas in coffee. As far as I understand, there were claims that El Paraiso used certain precursor essences in an effort to increase the concentration of gamma-decalactone. Propylene glycol (PG) was reportedly mentioned as one of the substances involved. - 1:09 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Since then, El Paraiso has claimed that they use precursor essences in their bioreactors to enhance or amplify specific aromatic compounds during fermentation. Believe it or not—that's the explanation they've given. - 1:10 AM `#origins-and-producers`: (To be clear, I'm a fan of some of El Paraiso's coffees myself. Letty in particular was absolutely fantastic for me) - 1:13 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I'm still drinking Aruzi. The more I drink it, the more it reminds me of that Santander coffee from El Roble that SEY released a few years ago—HR59... or was it HR61? I can't remember exactly. There's this combination of green grape, a faint musky aromatic quality, delicate florals, a touch of blackberry, and some tropical fruit notes that keeps bringing that coffee back to mind - 1:46 AM `#origins-and-producers`: After the El Paraiso debate, people from Korea actually went all the way to the farm to investigate it firsthand. In the end, though, there were still plenty of trade secrets, and nobody got the complete picture. These days, they seem a lot more aggressive and confident about it. The attitude feels more like, "Yeah, there are proprietary techniques involved. So what? If the coffee tastes great, that's what matters." Personally, I do think PG is part of the process there, but that's based on what I've seen and heard over the years rather than any direct confirmation from me - 1:46 AM `#origins-and-producers`: And despite all of that, I genuinely love Letty, ha - 1:47 AM `#origins-and-producers`: And now there's the Hachi project. I haven't tasted it myself, so I don't have much to say about it. From what I've heard, though, the general reaction seems to be more "it's fine" than "it's amazing." - 1:47 AM `#origins-and-producers`: I don't think it's quite that simple. PG is actually used quite broadly in a variety of applications, and some of the so-called "essences" they're talking about are things like coffee flower extracts. - 1:49 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Of course, it's always possible that someone, somewhere, could use substances that people would consider undesirable. But honestly, coffee already comes with plenty of variables and potential concerns of its own, so I don't think that's the issue I worry about most. That said, allergies are a completely different matter. If a coffee is co-fermented with something like peanut butter, for example, then people with peanut allergies should absolutely be informed and take appropriate precautions - 1:51 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Mango can be an allergen for some people, and the same is true for various stone fruit. For individuals with severe food allergies, co-fermented coffees may warrant extra caution, especially when the ingredients used during processing are not clearly disclosed - 1:52 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Haha, China got there first - 1:53 AM `#origins-and-producers`: They have a peanut butter catimor - 1:56 AM `#origins-and-producers`: This is probably getting into slightly questionable territory, but a Korean green coffee importer once interviewed a producer who had previously worked with Diego Bermudez, and they apparently learned quite a few behind-the-scenes details. From what I remember, though, none of it sounded particularly damning. In fact, the importer eventually started working with Diego again afterward, which probably tells you something. The general message seemed to be: "We're secretive, sure, but we're not doing anything malicious." And that was more or less the end of it - 2:27 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Haha, I once had a thermal shock Aji, and it tasted like someone mixed chili paste into a milkshake
 - 2:31 AM `#origins-and-producers`: Haha, I’ll just stick to SEY’s Colombias. Lance can taste the experimental stuff first and spit it out on behalf of the rest of us - 4:45 AM `#current-menu`: Assuming the coffee is free of roasting defects, I think the reality is that we're mostly talking about differences in taste rather than differences in quality. As disappointing as that may sound, a lot of it comes down to personal preference. All we can really do is trust that the roasteries we enjoy will continue to source excellent coffees.. - 4:47 AM `#current-menu`: The UL coffees I have are significantly lighter than anything I've had from SEY. To get a proper extraction, I have to push the brewing temperature all the way up to 97°C in my setup, whereas I'm currently brewing the SEY coffee at around 85°C. At least in my environment, that's what it takes. Sometimes I feel like UL takes things a bit too far. Their roasts can be incredibly extreme. - 4:49 AM `#current-menu`: One thing I often hear from friends is that UL coffees are at their best only when you have a very controlled water recipe. To be fair, I don't think they're wrong. You can often make these coffees come alive just by pushing the magnesium a bit higher. The issue is that most brewing environments aren't set up that way, which makes these coffees far less forgiving than they might appear. - 5:03 AM `#current-menu`: One recent example would be duck-rabbit's Ethiopia. I actually thought it was a very well-roasted UL coffee. The aromatics were expressive, the coffee was vibrant, and there were no obvious roasting mistakes. But I still found it a bit rough. There was a certain coarseness to the cup that I didn't particularly enjoy. It made me wonder whether I would have preferred it if the roast had gone just a little further, even at the cost of losing some of the aromatics. That's the eternal dilemma for roasters, isn't it? Do you preserve the aroma, or do you sacrifice a bit of it for greater refinement and sweetness? A lot of UL roasters choose preservation. The upside is incredible transparency and aromatic intensity. The downside is that you can sometimes end up with cereal, grain, or slightly green-tasting notes that not everyone enjoys. - 5:04 AM `#current-menu`: Good luck, roasters 👍 - 5:05 AM `#current-menu`: See? Even when it comes to UL, people's opinions are all over the place ha - 5:06 AM `#current-menu`: I think the coffee I had was Idido. It was roasted extremely light—significantly lighter than anything I've had from SEY - 5:09 AM `#current-menu`: Even if SEY roasted more lighter and Lance somehow unlocked the secrets of the universe, people still don't think it would taste like UL. Ha - 5:11 AM `#current-menu`: I think there might be a certain "UL character" that a lot of people recognize, and I'm not convinced it has much to do with how light the coffee is roasted - 5:15 AM `#current-menu`: Don't worry, I actually enjoy these kinds of discussions, haha. In the end, it's all fine as long as we can just say, "Ah, it's a just of personal preference," and move on - 6:57 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: This coffee was harvested from a place called “Bowicha” and processed at Harobedame. It’s a natural coffee from Gedeb, grown at an extremely high altitude of around 2,515m. Despite the impressive background, the cup itself is surprisingly classic in profile. I get notes of strawberry, blackberry, a subtle Chinese black tea character, a hint of lychee and tropical fruit, finishing with dark chocolate. I’ve had both the natural and washed lots from Harobedame, and I actually prefer the washed Attachments: - [IMG_1328.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1515218487956475904/IMG_1328.JPEG?ex=6a36c66e&is=6a3574ee&hm=aee1cae3fdad20f107cfcef87af8be516912d4eaaaf30e6649c2dd03214054a2&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 7:03 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: And a fresh delivery just arrived—two coffees gifted by a friend: one from Luis Salas, and the other Finca Tamana from Fritz. I do like VC varieties in general, but I’ve never really been a big fan of VC from Finca Tamana
 so I’m honestly very curious to see how this one turns out, ha......... Attachments: - [IMG_1329.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1515219985704947722/IMG_1329.JPEG?ex=6a36c7d4&is=6a357654&hm=16fd0eb3a52de1cdc67dc22e3c4f0a1a6f5cf6f5e67fc55f000a96b35321e375&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 8:15 AM `#origins-and-producers`: India is actually pretty interesting. The infrastructure in some areas is quite advanced—arguably even more than China in certain aspects. And they’re producing a wide range of experimental coffees - 1:36 PM `#origins-and-producers`: I've heard of flowers, botanical extracts, and similar materials being used during processing ### 2026-06-14 - 1:17 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Now i drinking this Attachments: - [IMG_1331.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1515495365451841586/IMG_1331.JPEG?ex=6a3676cb&is=6a35254b&hm=5a2b9aa006ddc1db3bfae119c312688d088d85d331708fc4c4c33e9ba79dc4ee&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 1:19 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Bright Meyer lemon, intertwined with a dense banana sweetness, followed by layers of tropical fruit. There's a sticky, almost syrupy texture that clings to the palate, giving the impression of a fruit smoothie or even a milkshake built from multiple fruits blended together. Interestingly, the floral character remains restrained—just a gentle hint of jasmine emerging in the finish before fading away. Overall, this is a decidedly fruit-driven coffee. - 1:21 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Rather than feeling bright and lively, the coffee has a noticeable fermented character. That said, it's still quite enjoyable and definitely unique. - 2:29 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Marlene Rojas? No idea, unfortunately—I never picked up a bag. I might have to see if one of my friends has some left and is willing to share(or just mug..). My coffee was roasted on either May 24th or May 28th - 5:47 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: Now i drinking : Karatu Karatu was one of those coffees that I initially dismissed as fairly ordinary. But after a heavy lunch, I found myself craving something refreshing, so I decided to brew it again. I'm getting blackberry, and quite unexpectedly, a distinct oak-like note. That's not something I normally associate with Kenya coffees—it's more commonly found in coffees from places like Papua New Guinea or occasionally Cuba. Maybe it's because I haven't had it in a while, but it tastes completely different from what I remember. here are also some of those rhubarb-like characteristics I often enjoy in Nordic-roasted Kenyans, along with darker berry notes. verything else makes sense, but the sudden appearance of that oak character really caught me off guard. Attachments: - [IMG_1336.JPEG](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1483078064119222384/1515563233644249299/IMG_1336.JPEG?ex=6a36b600&is=6a356480&hm=ae96399b2d26b2b32a20ac9f40f1b2000f4a89e20db9f0e5b82695a99d6fced4&) (image/jpeg 1536x2048) - 6:00 AM `#what-are-you-brewing`: It's definitely a different style from the Kenyan SEY used to favor - 3:08 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: http://samadoyo.com/en/products/5e6264634bf59f19638937ed - 3:08 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: CP-12 - 3:37 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: https://www.hario-usa.com/products/v60-range-server - 3:37 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: I recommend this - 3:38 PM `#what-are-you-brewing`: As far as I know, the 02 size fits perfectly [[#Index|Back to index]] ------------------- ## GPT-5.5 Thinking Summary ### seylance2897 - On Ethiopia sourcing, seylance2897 said SEY will have an allocation of an ALO washed lot that was the best coffee he tasted while in Ethiopia, though he expects a few other lots may compete with it. - On Gerald Kamberare, he said Gerald is making a small mid-harvest honey experimental lot for SEY; because the volume is tiny, it is easier to run fun tests, and they would know whether it was good enough to buy/roast after about 20 days of drying. - On Duber, he described the coffee as "very, very good," available in subscriptions only for people receiving five or more coffees, and later called it fascinating but hard to describe: fruit bouncing between jammy, fresh, and very bright expressions. - On David Berrio and Dwight, he said David Berrio's coffee was cupping like clean passion fruit with a bright acidic kick, while Dwight's red Gesha was highly floral and showed a proper Gesha profile. - On Guatemala, he argued the country has had a hard time because of climate change, soil degradation, old varieties, unintended Catimor crosses, and Gesha being the wrong fit for many Guatemalan conditions; he sees future potential if soil remediation and better/diverse varieties improve. - On extraction and roast development, he pushed back against roasting for maximum solubility, saying he feels too much is lost in the roaster when chasing peak solubility; in the cafe, SEY was targeting around 24% extraction in AeroPress but planned to move toward pour-overs with lower EY. - On buying strategy, he said SEY's investment logic in places like Urrao, Huila, Kenya, and Peru is to pay higher prices to encourage higher quality, essentially competing against themselves rather than trying to get better coffee cheaper. - On varieties and genetics, he said SL9 remains mysterious, shared genetic-fingerprinting notes linking it to the Ethiopian Legacy group near SL-09, and emphasized that many old variety labels are uncertain. - On processing transparency, he was tolerant of flavored or co-fermented coffees existing if they help producers and consumers enjoy them, but objected to opaque labeling, especially when "co-fermented" or "infused" lots are really using flavorings. - On roast color and evaluation, he said SEY coffees were currently around 135-140 on the DiFluid color track because lighter than 140 often tastes cereal to them; he argued that table bias can make a properly developed 140 coffee taste "dark" beside cereal-like 145 coffees. ### lancehedrick - On brewing SEY coffees, lancehedrick said his recommended recipe is meant to be easy to explain and adaptable: gentle double blooms, then an aggressive final pour, with ZP6 around 4.5 for his preference and closer to 5+ for more agitation. - On water, he said he personally rarely changes water because he feels extreme water tailoring can "season" the coffee and obscure coffee-to-coffee intricacies, though he acknowledged it can massively change taste and can be useful for understanding hype around a coffee. - On extraction theory, he traced the high-EY zeitgeist partly to Scott Rao and the idea that better grinders and coffees could be pushed harder, but argued that above roughly 22% extraction you increasingly pull more bitter compounds and fewer compounds associated with fruit/floral notes. - On small-dose brewing, he disagreed that tiny doses have a higher ceiling; in his experience, doses below roughly 20-22 g often produce hollow cups with florals at the edges but no satisfying middle. - On Duber, he repeatedly praised it, said it was still giving him pineapple after a live brew, and used it to redirect a heated channel moment back toward coffee. - On Sidra, he recalled competing with a lactic washed Sidra in 2018, said Soledad and Gertrudis helped make Sidra more household-name in Ecuador, and admitted he dislikes the green/eucalyptus element that some Sidras show. - On rest, he said he rests TPC and Substance coffees about two weeks and questioned the idea that light roasts universally need very long rests; he said graininess does not rest out in his own testing. - On roast color, he argued that color readings are a useful slice of objectivity, not a complete account of roast quality; he emphasized grinding extremely fine, flattening the sample, taking repeated readings, and controlling protocol because readings can drift substantially. - On SEY's roasting direction, he clarified that SEY is not trying to be ultra-light or compete for lightest roast, but to present very high-quality green as purely as possible under strict cup-quality standards. - On water for espresso machines, he said Pavlis water is basically 45 ppm KHCO3 and works fine for machine safety; he is skeptical that small potassium-bicarbonate differences are consistently tasteable because brewed coffee already contains far more potassium. ### opp4004 - On harvest separations, opp4004 said he initially thought SEY's separate harvest-window releases, such as Wilson Alba / El Porvenir-type examples, were mostly marketing, but after tasting enough of them he came to value how different the cups could be. - On Pink Bourbon and Palestina, he said San Agustin Pink Bourbons began to feel familiar to him, while Palestina producers such as Wilson Alba kept surprising him with a wider flavor range; one cup showed brewed hibiscus, herbal character, sour candy, tropical fruit, and a Kenya-like aromatic lift. - On Chinese roasters and coffees, he grouped Big Sur, AOKKA, and Coffeebuff as Chinese roasters that both roast well and buy very good green, with Big Sur at the top; he described a Coffeebuff Kenyan natural distributed by Kamavindi as fermented but enjoyable, with mulberry, raspberry, pink grapefruit, lychee-like fruit, passion-fruit sweetness/acidity, and background florals. - On rest, he said 2-3 weeks is usually enough for most flavors to show, that he sometimes drinks coffee under one week off roast without much negative reaction, and that resting may simplify or settle a cup but will not turn bad coffee into good coffee. - On OXO Rapid Brewer / ORB, he said it is excellent not only for "soup" but also for non-bypass-style coffee if tamping is skipped; he gave a 14 g easier-drinking recipe using coarse-salt grind, 240 ml water at 94-97C, bottom paper plus optional top AeroPress-style filter, no tamping, and very slow pumping. - On Asian coffee processing, he described Chinese, Vietnamese, Indian, Thai, and Myanmar experiments with robusta, Catimor, co-ferments, Moutai-like processing, and tea-influenced infrastructure; he thinks China's tea-processing context and sensory preferences create coffees with distinctive tea, fermentation, savory, grain, or roasted notes. - On Indonesia, he was optimistic, especially about fully washed Indonesian coffees, advanced processing, Java Halu lots, Wahana/Sidikalang Java, and mythical varieties like Abyssinia; he said the biggest challenge is not flavor but defects, making color sorting a major confidence factor. - On genetic uncertainty, he argued that "SL28" in Latin America may often be a field designation rather than a single genotype, citing cases like Herbazu/Kenia and broader mislabeling patterns with Pink Bourbon, Gesha, and Sidra. - On processing transparency, he argued that yeast, native microbes, fruit glucose, co-fermentation, parchment dried near other materials, and farm-isolated inocula all sit on a spectrum of intervention; the key issue is disclosure so consumers know what they are drinking. - On ultra-light roasting, he said some UL coffees require very high brew temperatures or controlled water to come alive, and that while they can preserve transparency and aromatics, they may also bring cereal, grain, green, or rough notes that not everyone enjoys. ### Cross-thread takeaways - The biggest recurring thread was **transparency versus experimentation**: seylance2897 objected to opaque flavoring and vague processing terms, opp4004 mapped a spectrum from yeast to co-ferments to aroma carriers, and both converged on disclosure as the key requirement. - **Genetic testing and variety ambiguity** were central: SL9, SL28, Kenia, K7, Sidra, Pink Bourbon, and mislabeled Gesha all came up as examples where field names can diverge from genetic reality. - **Roast color and ultra-light roasting** became a major debate: SEY's side defended color metrics and blind cupping as useful objectivity, while opp4004 emphasized that some UL coffees can be technically good but unforgiving, rough, or preference-dependent. - **Harvest separation mattered across multiple discussions**: seylance2897 described early/mid/late harvest separations and Pocho's branch-position experiments, while opp4004 said tasting harvest-window releases changed his mind about whether those separations were meaningful. - **Peru, Colombia, Ecuador, Ethiopia, Kenya, Guatemala, and Indonesia** all appeared as active sourcing frontiers, but with different problems: Peru has high potential but not yet Panama-level top scores; Guatemala struggles with varieties/climate; Ecuador has many small lots moving year-round; Indonesia has promise but defect risk. - **Brewing advice was pragmatic rather than dogmatic**: lancehedrick emphasized adaptable pour pattern and preference, seylance2897 emphasized cupping protocol and avoiding too much agitation, and opp4004 gave ORB recipes where the 22 g version has the higher floor and 14 g version the higher ceiling. - **Cupping culture was treated as both serious work and social ritual**: seylance2897 pushed advanced community cuppings and blind triangulations, lancehedrick described blind critique as a different mental mode, and opp4004 joked that blind tasting drives him insane because expectations often collapse on reveal. 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